1. I was off work.
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2. It was probably
ten o'clock, eleven o'clock at night.
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3. And my phone rang, and it was my boss,
the head of the whole company.
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4. And I answered the phone,
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5. and he didn't say anything
other than just, "I hate you."
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6. He just said it. He was just like,
"I hate you! I fucking hate you!"
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7. And then he just hung up.
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8. And that was it.
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9. Just, like, the middle of the night,
he just called me to tell me he hated me.
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10. I mean, that was, like,
a regular day at American Apparel.
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11. New brand of clothing
has been appearing around America.
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12. American Apparel.
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13. - American Apparel.
- American Apparel.
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14. It's one of the fastest
growing and hippest clothing makers
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15. in the country.
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16. It just felt cool 'cause it was
so different, and I liked the different.
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17. American Apparel stores
have opened in 11 countries
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18. with sales of $300 million.
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19. Wow. I wanna be a part of this.
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20. It was a fashion cult.
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21. What's up?
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22. And Dov was the leader.
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23. I hated it!
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24. There was just this energy around him.
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25. It's T-shirts that feel good, look good,
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26. that are made
in a non-exploitative setting.
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27. Roll 'em down. Super cute.
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28. The advertisements
were basically soft-core porn.
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29. There's a sexual element of fashion
that's inescapable.
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30. American Apparel became my life.
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31. I had an assistant,
the CEO calling and texting me.
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32. I felt like I was king of industry.
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33. I loved every second of it,
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34. until I didn't.
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35. Dov was unpredictable.
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36. You fucking idiot!
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37. He would push people
as far as they could go.
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38. You're not good enough!
You're not strong enough!
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39. Then the recession hit.
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40. Here's a company that's not done so well.
We're talking about American Apparel.
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41. Here, a fucking disaster. Figure it out.
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42. Things progressively
got crazier and crazier.
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43. There has been video
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44. where he was literally
running around naked,
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45. while two female employees
were in the room with him.
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46. Are you fucking kidding me?
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47. It was absolutely
earth-shatteringly dehumanizing
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48. to be employed at this company.
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49. This is fucked up.
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50. Come on, everybody, stop working.
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51. American Apparel
became this iconic fireball.
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52. Somebody has driven this company
absolutely into the ground.
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53. I'll probably be in therapy
until the day that I die.
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54. I need to get the hell outta here.
This is crazy.
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55. Ugh, you're having me walk in,
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56. and I didn't even have enough time
to get on Ozempic.
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57. It was the mid-2000s.
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58. UGG boots were everywhere,
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59. Facebook was the hot new thing,
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60. and people were outraged
by Janet Jackson's wardrobe malfunction.
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61. One day,
I was taking the public transit home,
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62. and I got a City Weekly paper.
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63. On the back,
there was a clothing store ad.
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64. And it said, "Now open,"
with the girl with her legs spread open.
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65. And I said, "Oh my God, that is fashion."
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66. The company was called American Apparel.
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67. And it said that they had an open call
for people to work there, and so I went.
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68. I always loved fashion.
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69. It just came natural.
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70. But, growing up,
I had learning disabilities.
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71. And I kept applying to these fashion jobs,
and I would never get them.
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72. So I did phone sex for money.
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73. Hi, gorgeous, it's me...
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74. Tilly McEloise. How are you?
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75. When I got to the open call,
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76. I was like, "I'm not gonna get it again."
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77. "I'm destined to be
a phone sex operator till the end."
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78. And so I went in,
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79. and there was a girl
sitting in the dressing room.
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80. And I gave her my résumé,
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81. which was basically
a blank piece of paper.
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82. And she kind of
just, like, tossed it to the side,
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83. looked me up and down,
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84. and she was like,
"So what do you wanna do here?"
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85. And I was like,
"Mm, I guess fashion merchandising."
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86. She was like, "Great. You could be
the district merchandising manager."
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87. "Can you start right now?"
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88. And I was like, "Oh, cool."
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89. "Let's do this."
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90. Control yourself
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91. Take only what you need from it...
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92. The new brand
of clothing called American Apparel
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93. is appearing in cities around America.
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94. There are suddenly lots of these stores.
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95. An American Apparel store
had opened up in the neighborhood.
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96. And I did an interview,
and I gave a résumé in,
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97. but I think
it was really more of, like, a vibe check.
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98. I guess I passed.
I think it was my physique.
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99. I'm really tall and skinny,
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100. and that was kind of
what was already in the advertisements.
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101. You were a child
Crawlin' on your knees toward it...
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102. I had nose piercings and, like,
a pixie cut and really loud glasses.
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103. What I was going for was,
honestly, hipster bike messenger.
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104. She's like, "That's the look we want,"
not, "You know, you've got experience."
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105. It was like, "You've got the look."
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106. They definitely were hiring
freaks and geeks, you know?
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107. I mean, it felt like the weirdo club.
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108. And actually one of the slogans was,
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109. "If you see someone shoplifting,
let 'em know we're hiring."
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110. I definitely couldn't afford
the clothes at American Apparel.
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111. So my friend and I would go
there and shoplift.
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112. I probably wore
that one American Apparel shirt
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113. that I shoplifted to the interview.
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114. The manager just came out,
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115. and kinda looked at my outfit,
took a photo of me,
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116. and was like,
"You can start Monday if you want."
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117. I kinda felt chosen.
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118. Like, "I must be cool."
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119. "Like, I must be
an American Apparel person."
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120. The reason why American Apparel
is such a hot thing right now
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121. is because they're offering you
a new, clean look.
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122. Walking into American Apparel
felt different from any other retailer.
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123. It wasn't like walking
into The Gap or J. Crew.
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124. It was sexy and very cool.
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125. We're a basic store.
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126. People are using our stuff
to turn it into their own style.
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127. One of the big appeals of American Apparel
was its antithesis to other brands.
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128. It was right at that time
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129. of famous people's offspring
becoming famous.
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130. Simple Life was a thing.
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131. And it was just trashy logos everywhere.
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132. American Apparel was so simple.
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133. Just solid basics. No logo.
Every color you can imagine.
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134. It was almost like whenever
the bug is, like, drawn to a light,
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135. it just, like, pulls you in.
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136. Right now, we just remodeled my store.
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137. We made it really big.
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138. At first, when I started working,
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139. I was just kind of there
dressing the mannequins,
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140. organizing the store.
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141. Look at all these
gorgeous, gorgeous colors.
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142. And I would hear
these, like, whispers in the back like,
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143. "Oh my God, that's fab."
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144. "I'm gonna send a picture of that to Dov."
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145. And I was like, "Who's Dov?"
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146. - You ready to go?
- Yeah.
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147. I think we never arrive.
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148. As human beings, we're kind of trained
to try and do better the next time, right?
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149. Things evolve, things change.
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150. And the apparel industry
has to be reinvented.
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151. I run American Apparel
in an instinctive manner,
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152. an impulsive manner.
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153. I try to break down all kinds of barriers.
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154. What's up?
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155. Enter Dov Charney,
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156. a flamboyant, Canadian-born,
LA clothing entrepreneur.
Copy !req
157. Charney says he's on a crusade
to smash the garment industry's culture
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158. of worker exploitation from within.
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159. This is basically the pitch.
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160. It's— It's T-shirts that look good,
T-shirts that feel good,
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161. and T-shirts that are made
in a non-exploitative setting.
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162. He was selling this
Made in America, sweatshop-free thing,
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163. and I thought it was great.
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164. Like, there was more to it
than just being cool.
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165. It was also, like, meaningful.
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166. - You're tight. Relax.
- Oh.
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167. Relax, it's California.
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168. Dov Charney is the biggest manufacturer
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169. still making T-shirts in America.
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170. He pays his workers
well over minimum wage.
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171. We've undervalued this job
in— in the last 30 years.
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172. This is a hard damn job.
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173. At American Apparel,
everything was made in America.
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174. Nobody else was doing that.
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175. And you'd hear critics talking about,
"You'll never be successful doing this."
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176. "It's not a sustainable model,
it costs too much."
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177. And he was just, like, diehard about it.
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178. We try to do things ourselves.
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179. I, today, have to compete with China,
and I say, "Let's play hockey, I'm ready."
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180. That's what I do.
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181. Dov was really passionate
about immigration
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182. and was kind of like,
"Why do we even have borders?"
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183. I believe in an open immigration policy.
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184. I think people should be able to go live
where they wanna live in the world.
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185. And that ethos was a big thing for me.
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186. I was like, "There's so much good
about this company."
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187. What's the key to success?
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188. Passion.
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189. - That's it?
- That's it.
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190. Oh my God, the first time Dov
came into the store, I was so excited.
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191. Someone was like,
"Dov is coming, everyone get ready."
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192. And there was this frenzy.
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193. You could hear him before you saw him
and sense his presence before you saw him.
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194. I don't wanna freak it out that bad,
but we could.
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195. I think Monday nights are more important
'cause lots of shipments are coming in.
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196. You wanna capture things
like the denim jacket.
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197. Push them into the floor.
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198. When he walked in,
I just thought he was so sexy.
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199. - What's your name?
- Kayla.
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200. Kayla, okay. Hi.
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201. He, like, had this whole pep talk
with us, like,
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202. "We're gonna rule the world."
Like, "Are you with me, or are you not?"
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203. Like it was a show, and I love a show.
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204. Anybody ever call you hyper?
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205. Yeah, people call me hyper every day.
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206. I think I was born overcharged.
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207. Dov, he lived, breathed,
ate American Apparel all the time.
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208. He almost never slept.
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209. He wouldn't even take breaks to eat food.
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210. He would send out his number,
just be like, "Call me whenever."
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211. "Like, call me day, night."
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212. And he expected the same of his employees.
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213. You know why he doesn't answer?
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214. - It's four o'clock in the morning.
- That's not the reason.
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215. He doesn't answer
when it's 1:00 in the afternoon.
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216. I started to stay way late,
you know, not take time off.
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217. If there was a 40-hour week,
it was because you were sick,
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218. and so you weren't working a few days.
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219. Like, no one was working that little.
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220. On one two-week period,
on top of the 80 hours that I worked,
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221. it was like 120-something hours
of overtime that I clocked.
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222. I did a 36-hour shift.
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223. That... Payroll didn't believe me.
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224. They had to check the cameras
to see that I was there.
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225. So you're around these people all day,
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226. and I think, through that,
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227. it allowed people
to bond at a deeper level.
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228. And I started to realize
it's not just me in therapy.
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229. We all have vulnerability,
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230. like moms that are similar to my mom,
who had... mental illness,
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231. and I'm like, "That's so wild."
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232. Before I worked at American Apparel,
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233. I was a huge drug addict,
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234. and working there, like,
kinda gave me meaning...
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235. like something to be a part of, you know?
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236. Where I'm from is very Mormon,
and I grew up very Mormon.
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237. That's very much my background.
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238. But as I grew up,
I really started questioning the church,
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239. and a lot of the people
in that neighborhood
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240. didn't really like it.
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241. And so when I was around 17,
I ran away from home,
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242. just looking for, like,
something that was different.
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243. And American Apparel became
that different thing I was looking for.
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244. The American Apparel
advertisements just broke every rule
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245. that, as a culture, we had back then.
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246. Clothing company
American Apparel has been widely condemned
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247. for its latest campaign.
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248. This, by the way,
is not American Apparel's
Copy !req
249. first controversial ad.
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250. The advertisements
were basically soft-core porn.
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251. There's a sexual element to fashion
that— that's inescapable.
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252. So, like, to then start saying,
"Ah! Let's get scared about sex,"
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253. it just doesn't add up.
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254. Dov seemed to find models
from just finding them in the store.
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255. Girls that he was like,
"You're attractive," or, "You're fun,"
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256. and he would go shoot with them.
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257. Charney's always
on the lookout for people like Natasha.
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258. He says he saw her walking down a street
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259. and jumped out of his limo
to offer her a job.
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260. - Is this true?
- It's definitely true.
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261. Did you think, "What— Who is this creep?"
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262. Yeah, I was in shock. I was like,
"Who's this? Where's he coming from?"
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263. She was suspicious,
but she did the photo shoot,
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264. and now she works for American Apparel.
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265. The women in the ads,
they weren't wearing makeup,
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266. they weren't posing
in a, you know, practiced way.
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267. We just go down to here.
It's nice with a little stretch mark.
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268. You know what I'm saying?
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269. You felt, "This person
isn't conventionally beautiful,
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270. they're not as thin,
they don't have hair extensions,
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271. they don't have makeup on."
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272. "Um, that could be me."
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273. I just love also
that it put a name to the person.
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274. Like, it gives a bio of the person.
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275. Yes, some of it was very suggestive,
but it was a brilliant idea.
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276. - This model works here?
- Yeah, she works downstairs.
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277. What was interesting
about Dov Charney and American Apparel
Copy !req
278. is that it had a transgressive side
and an idealistic side,
Copy !req
279. and the sex without the idealism
would just be sleazy,
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280. but the idealistic part
without the sex would be boring.
Copy !req
281. Dov embodied both of those, um, beliefs
and acted on them,
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282. and the company
was expanding very quickly.
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283. You don't need to be
at lunch with anybody right now.
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284. You'll be earlier in and later out.
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285. You can't play around.
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286. It absolutely felt competitive.
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287. It felt like you had to differentiate
yourself from other people,
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288. so that you wouldn't feel like Dov
could ask someone else to do your job.
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289. I've asked a million times.
I think it's coming in.
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290. Dov's very vocal. Just like,
whatever you're thinking, you say it.
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291. Like, "This is wrong."
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292. You're wrong. There's nothing.
If there's— There's nothing.
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293. And that was appealing to me
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294. because it's so opposite
of where I came from.
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295. Get the shit out of the store.
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296. So I really bought into it.
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297. I was like, "Okay, this is how
you'll be a successful adult,
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298. is you have to, like,
get in people's faces."
Copy !req
299. I went from lowest position
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300. to manager of the store
in, like, six months,
Copy !req
301. and it was— it was a big store too.
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302. But it still felt like
I needed to prove myself.
Copy !req
303. Like, there must be more to this company
that I could be a part of.
Copy !req
304. Fundamental to the American Apparel brand
Copy !req
305. is our revolutionary concept
of sweatshop-free vertical integration.
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306. All our products
are manufactured and marketed
Copy !req
307. at our 800,000-square-foot
downtown Los Angeles facility,
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308. the largest single-garment factory
in the United States.
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309. Everything happened there.
Copy !req
310. So, like, the marketing, the design,
all the clothes was made there.
Copy !req
311. After graduating college, I thought,
Copy !req
312. "If the point of grad school
is to just get a better job..."
Copy !req
313. "... what if I bypass grad school
and I just apply to the factory?"
Copy !req
314. So I sent a letter of interest to HR,
Copy !req
315. and I got it.
Copy !req
316. Getting a job at the factory,
for me, was a really big deal.
Copy !req
317. It was, like, close to the action,
and that was really exciting.
Copy !req
318. Like, "Pfft, yeah, right,
this is, like— This is who I am now."
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319. There, look,
here's a whole bunch of people
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320. working really hard at sewing things.
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321. Hola!
Copy !req
322. Once you got to the factory,
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323. the initiation was where you knew
you were definitely in Dov's inner circle,
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324. you would get a starter kit.
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325. So the starter kit was a Leica camera,
a new BlackBerry phone,
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326. a copy of The 48 Laws of Power,
a book of strategies for success,
Copy !req
327. and a Hitachi Magic Wand vibrator.
Copy !req
328. So I kept the BlackBerry,
I kept the camera,
Copy !req
329. of course I kept the vibrator,
Copy !req
330. and I threw away The 48 Laws of Power.
Copy !req
331. I just cared
about sex, drugs, and T-shirts.
Copy !req
332. In the stores, in the factory,
Copy !req
333. across the board, you know,
sex was everywhere.
Copy !req
334. Everyone was sleeping together,
Copy !req
335. and you would see, like,
some of the employees,
Copy !req
336. like, hooking up in the stairwells.
Copy !req
337. We were young and horny.
Copy !req
338. And it definitely felt like
there was a free-sex vibe.
Copy !req
339. I mean, it was all part of the revolution.
Copy !req
340. Despite a drop in retail-industry profits,
Copy !req
341. sales at American Apparel are up.
Copy !req
342. I quickly moved up in positions
and got all these responsibilities.
Copy !req
343. Hello?
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344. At 25, I had two cell phones,
Copy !req
345. I had the CEO calling and texting me.
Copy !req
346. You know, I'm like, "Oh my God,
I'm really doing this adult thing."
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347. Okay, here's our PR office.
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348. I worked my way up to be in charge
of fashion media and product placement.
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349. The joys of being
America's fastest-growing retailer.
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350. I was away from home,
doing something and getting promoted.
Copy !req
351. So it was like, "Look at me now, Dad.
I don't need you guys."
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352. I'm 21 years old.
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353. Like, I'm a manager of all these stores.
All these employees answer to me.
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354. I have all this, like, power.
Copy !req
355. What did that feel like?
Copy !req
356. I felt like I was, like, king of industry.
Copy !req
357. Whether you worked
at the factory or in the stores,
Copy !req
358. every time we got a bonus or a promotion,
or any time our salaries changed at all,
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359. they would have us sign
a mediation agreement that said,
Copy !req
360. "Hey," like, "I've recently
been offered more money,
Copy !req
361. and that means I can't sue Dov,
Copy !req
362. I can't talk about, uh,
anything negative about the company."
Copy !req
363. Maybe I was naive,
Copy !req
364. but, "I'm sure it'll be fine,
I'll just sign."
Copy !req
365. As an entire company,
we had weekly conference calls.
Copy !req
366. All the stores were expected to call in,
Copy !req
367. regardless of where they were
across the world.
Copy !req
368. Sometimes, you'd dial in the line,
Copy !req
369. and it'd say
there were too many participants.
Copy !req
370. It was like, "How is that possible?"
Copy !req
371. But it was just
hundreds and hundreds of people.
Copy !req
372. Right now,
we're mopping up a lot of crap here.
Copy !req
373. You need to get these stores solved, okay?
Copy !req
374. If your store was not performing well,
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375. the conference call
was potentially a very scary time for you
Copy !req
376. because you would be
at threat of being called out by Dov.
Copy !req
377. Welcome to fucking the real world!
Copy !req
378. I, both, looked forward to it
and dreaded it.
Copy !req
379. That's right, you are a schmuck.
Did you hear...
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380. It was equally as entertaining
as it was scary.
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381. There was these different things,
like Fool of the Week.
Copy !req
382. There was always someone
that he'd call, "Fool of the Week."
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383. You know,
"Michelle, you're the fool of the week!"
Copy !req
384. "Fool of the week, you're fucking me!"
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385. Like, oh my God.
Copy !req
386. I mean, it was so mortifying
that hundreds and hundreds of people heard
Copy !req
387. that you personally
are the Fool of the Week
Copy !req
388. for a multi-million-dollar company.
Copy !req
389. It did feel uncomfortable, like,
"Fuck, I know I'm not supposed to laugh
Copy !req
390. 'cause he's also yelling
at this person I respect and like."
Copy !req
391. And then he's also saying something
incredibly funny in the next thought,
Copy !req
392. and it is so weird
and challenging and confusing
Copy !req
393. 'cause you're like, "Do I hate him,
or do I think he's hilarious?"
Copy !req
394. At that point in time,
Copy !req
395. even though
I was still working at the stores,
Copy !req
396. making, like, $9 minimum wage,
Copy !req
397. I really got a sense
that, like, if you had an idea,
Copy !req
398. anything was possible
with American Apparel.
Copy !req
399. So I pitched this marketing idea,
and, suddenly, I was on a flight to LA.
Copy !req
400. I'd been traveling all day,
Copy !req
401. I got to the factory,
it's like 11:00 p.m.,
Copy !req
402. and I can just hear Dov
rambling, like, talking business.
Copy !req
403. And I'm like,
"How is this guy still at the factory?"
Copy !req
404. And I'm like,
"Please, I've been traveling all day."
Copy !req
405. "Where do I stay?"
Copy !req
406. He kind of looked at me and was like,
"Why don't you stay at my house?"
Copy !req
407. Look at this huge home in Silver Lake.
Copy !req
408. This is the Garbutt House,
perched above the Silver Lake Reservoir,
Copy !req
409. an historic home owned by Dov Charney.
Copy !req
410. It's at the top
of this little gated community.
Copy !req
411. You go in, and the whole house
is this creamy marble stone.
Copy !req
412. It's absolutely gorgeous.
Copy !req
413. Jonny Makeup was living there as well.
Copy !req
414. My friends were like,
"Why're you living with your boss?"
Copy !req
415. And I was like,
"Why wouldn't I live with my boss?"
Copy !req
416. "Why wouldn't you live with your boss
Copy !req
417. if you had the opportunity
to live in a big, gorgeous house?"
Copy !req
418. The door is always unlocked, always open,
and there are just girls everywhere.
Copy !req
419. You know, making breakfast
and, like, walking his dog.
Copy !req
420. And, I don't know, like a little,
I don't want to say, "Playboy Mansion."
Copy !req
421. I guess it was like
the Playboy Mansion, but for hipsters.
Copy !req
422. It was unclear, like,
what sort of relationship
Copy !req
423. some of the girls had with Dov
Copy !req
424. 'cause if his door was closed,
I wasn't supposed to go in.
Copy !req
425. It was definitely an open secret
that Dov was sleeping with the employees.
Copy !req
426. Look, I'm a single, young guy.
Copy !req
427. You fall in love with someone,
you know, "It's great to meet you."
Copy !req
428. "You're the woman of my life."
Copy !req
429. "I think you're, like, an ace in the hole,
Copy !req
430. but, sorry, you know, we can't."
Copy !req
431. "'cause you work for me or him
or her, it'd be inappropriate."
Copy !req
432. "It'd be this, it'd be that."
Copy !req
433. You know, the heart wants
what the heart wants.
Copy !req
434. I left Dov's house
after my manager at the factory warned me,
Copy !req
435. "Look, if you stay
at his place any longer,
Copy !req
436. you're going to become a 'Dov girl.'"
Copy !req
437. The Dov girl.
Copy !req
438. That was somebody who...
Copy !req
439. They don't really have a— a job title.
Copy !req
440. Maybe they're Dov's girlfriend.
Copy !req
441. Maybe they just travel with him,
but they do the things that he wants.
Copy !req
442. And they have that responsibility
because of the way they look.
Copy !req
443. You were kind of afraid of the Dov girls
if they were around.
Copy !req
444. They're this kind of, like, hit squad.
Copy !req
445. You know, at my desk,
there'd be some girl that would show up,
Copy !req
446. with a micro-mesh shirt
and nothing underneath,
Copy !req
447. and tell me something that I needed to do.
Copy !req
448. And it would sort of be like,
"Excuse me, who are you?"
Copy !req
449. It's like, "Dov says you have to do this."
Copy !req
450. Women are important to have around,
and they're easy to fall in love with.
Copy !req
451. So what are you gonna do?
You know what I mean?
Copy !req
452. - Right, Carla?
- Yes.
Copy !req
453. - All right.
- That's the way you work.
Copy !req
454. From Los Angeles to Tokyo,
Copy !req
455. in just three years,
Copy !req
456. American Apparel stores have opened
in 11 countries around the world
Copy !req
457. with sales of some $300 million last year.
Copy !req
458. There were billboards everywhere.
Copy !req
459. They were on the back of buses.
Copy !req
460. They were on, like, benches.
And you couldn't escape it.
Copy !req
461. Kendra, honey!
Copy !req
462. And there was the whole celebrity thing.
Copy !req
463. Um, this is head-to-toe American Apparel.
Copy !req
464. Where we would make custom clothes
for pop stars going on tour,
Copy !req
465. like Rihanna, Britney Spears.
Copy !req
466. And, oh my God,
Beyoncé used to come late at night.
Copy !req
467. We would close the store down for her.
Copy !req
468. It was amazing.
Copy !req
469. Your company is very successful.
Do you wanna take it public?
Copy !req
470. If we go public,
it will be on the right conditions.
Copy !req
471. I wanna do it on my own terms.
Copy !req
472. I also don't wanna be told what to do,
or how we— how our ad campaign should be
Copy !req
473. or what our political positioning
should be.
Copy !req
474. But if we do go public,
I assure you it'll be a hot stock.
Copy !req
475. American Apparel is going public.
Copy !req
476. With an infusion of millions of dollars
from a big investment company,
Copy !req
477. Charney plans to keep expanding.
Copy !req
478. When American Apparel
became a public company,
Copy !req
479. Dov created
a pretty cozy board of directors.
Copy !req
480. He was on it. There were four others.
Copy !req
481. Two of them were, uh,
personal friends of his.
Copy !req
482. One was Robert Greene,
author of The 48 Laws of Power.
Copy !req
483. Dov was the chief executive officer
and president.
Copy !req
484. There was no chief operating officer.
Copy !req
485. There was no chief technology officer.
Copy !req
486. I always get charged up
when I walk through the factory.
Copy !req
487. In fact, the first CFO that he hired,
Copy !req
488. he called a loser
in The Wall Street Journal...
Copy !req
489. and then apologized.
Copy !req
490. The CFO left.
Copy !req
491. Dov's management style was basically
Copy !req
492. to push people as far as they could go
and to pit people against each other.
Copy !req
493. Dov would call you on the phone
and kinda trick you into saying something
Copy !req
494. about someone that was listening.
Copy !req
495. You know, someone would be like,
Copy !req
496. "Oh, Michelle's
not really doing a good job."
Copy !req
497. Like, "She kinda messed this thing up."
Copy !req
498. And Dov would be like, "Well,
Michelle's on the line with you now."
Copy !req
499. "Michelle, you're an idiot!"
Copy !req
500. You fucking idiot!
Copy !req
501. It's like a heavy narc culture.
Copy !req
502. You— You benefited
by tattle-telling on other people.
Copy !req
503. I told her to send me the fucking photos.
I reminded her, like, three times.
Copy !req
504. Like, it's...
Copy !req
505. It did seem like there were people
vying for his attention
Copy !req
506. and, you know,
wanting to be the favorite and stuff.
Copy !req
507. And, ultimately, like,
that caused a lot of, like, chaos
Copy !req
508. with people not getting along.
Copy !req
509. Is your internet working now?
Copy !req
510. One time, I really confronted a manager
Copy !req
511. that she was doing
such a bad job about something.
Copy !req
512. That— It, like, brought her to tears.
Copy !req
513. And I remember walking away from that
just feeling like I wanted to throw up.
Copy !req
514. But, you know, I had my eye on the prize,
Copy !req
515. and I felt like Dov
was the type of successful
Copy !req
516. that I thought I wanted to be,
Copy !req
517. and I was trying to emulate
the way that he operated.
Copy !req
518. Okay, what else?
Copy !req
519. Dov would look for the one thing
that you're doing to fuck him,
Copy !req
520. and he impulsively fired people
because of that.
Copy !req
521. We're gonna definitely focus
on making sure we haven't—
Copy !req
522. Who do we fire, Kirk?
Copy !req
523. - What?
- Who do we fire?
Copy !req
524. But he always defended it
as, like, a critical key to success.
Copy !req
525. When American Apparel went public,
Copy !req
526. Dov Charney used all the company's money
to open a lot more stores.
Copy !req
527. Halifax. Toronto.
Copy !req
528. London. New York. Woodbury.
Copy !req
529. Savannah. Miami.
Copy !req
530. Beijing.
Copy !req
531. But then the recession hit.
Copy !req
532. Good evening, everyone.
Copy !req
533. The signs were everywhere,
but now it's official.
Copy !req
534. We are in a recession.
Copy !req
535. A lot of really well-known retailers
were doing badly,
Copy !req
536. but American Apparel continued to expand.
Copy !req
537. In 2008, I remember people talking
about the recession,
Copy !req
538. and me being like,
"There was a recession in 2008?"
Copy !req
539. Like, 2008, American Apparel
was opening five stores in a city
Copy !req
540. and, like, going into a new country.
Copy !req
541. Recession didn't exist.
Copy !req
542. I need you to hire more merchandisers.
Copy !req
543. If your payroll gets heavy,
I'll travel with them.
Copy !req
544. That man, like... lit money on fire.
Copy !req
545. How many guys you know
in previous recessions
Copy !req
546. that were struggling, but kept it going
and then they really bump up?
Copy !req
547. Inside the company,
Copy !req
548. there was no one telling Dov
things that he didn't wanna hear.
Copy !req
549. Get over here!
Copy !req
550. And that's because, you know,
there were a lot of young people
Copy !req
551. who had the look that he liked,
but didn't have a lot of experience.
Copy !req
552. It was, like,
the most unnatural, scary thing
Copy !req
553. to try to tell Dov, "No."
Copy !req
554. Like, somebody like Dov
doesn't understand the word "no."
Copy !req
555. Wouldn't it be cheaper
for you to outsource?
Copy !req
556. Direct labor...
Copy !req
557. Just look at the immigration-reform thing
Copy !req
558. where Dov basically went to war
with the US government.
Copy !req
559. We are cracking down on employers who are,
Copy !req
560. uh, using illegal workers.
Copy !req
561. In 2009,
Immigration and Customs Enforcement,
Copy !req
562. known as ICE,
conducted an audit of American Apparel,
Copy !req
563. and they found that about 1,500 workers
were there with false or fake documents.
Copy !req
564. And American Apparel
had to let them all go.
Copy !req
565. The ICE raid was a huge financial burden
Copy !req
566. because, in a period
of big growth for the company...
Copy !req
567. Come on, everybody, stop working.
Copy !req
568. he was forced to let those people go...
Copy !req
569. Everybody, stop working.
Copy !req
570. and then rebuild a workforce.
Copy !req
571. We need to bring in more workers...
Copy !req
572. Okay? To take on the demand.
Copy !req
573. Dov was reeling from it
for a very long time.
Copy !req
574. And to maintain
the security of the company.
Copy !req
575. He felt like it was a deliberate attempt
to get at his company.
Copy !req
576. I mean, there was just
so much financial strain at that time,
Copy !req
577. so many bad decisions being made.
Copy !req
578. But rather than accepting responsibility,
Copy !req
579. he was starting to blame people
or look for things to blame.
Copy !req
580. Edmonton, a fucking disaster.
Here, a fucking disaster, okay?
Copy !req
581. Climb out and figure it out.
Copy !req
582. So if you were in front of him
at the wrong time or in the wrong mood,
Copy !req
583. you would be the target.
Copy !req
584. I really, at this time,
felt like I was personally responsible
Copy !req
585. for part of the reason
why the company wasn't doing well.
Copy !req
586. And I think that that triggered
that sort of predator response for him,
Copy !req
587. where he was like, "Oh, he doesn't know
what the fuck he's doing."
Copy !req
588. And he came after me.
Copy !req
589. You're gonna say, "I am sorry, sir,
Copy !req
590. that my team has fucked you up the ass."
Copy !req
591. You owe me!
Copy !req
592. I'm gonna make you work
the hours you did not work!
Copy !req
593. He'd yell, "If you can't take this,
then just fucking leave right now."
Copy !req
594. Hopefully, by the end of the night,
you'll quit or you'll fuckin' submit.
Copy !req
595. Okay? Quit or submit.
Copy !req
596. We're gonna play a game.
Copy !req
597. Bang! Let's go.
Copy !req
598. Quit or submit.
Copy !req
599. And then I remember
this one guy just got up and left.
Copy !req
600. And I remember the aftermath of that.
Copy !req
601. Everyone's like, "Pfft, what a loser."
Copy !req
602. Like, "He's so weak
he can't put up with this?"
Copy !req
603. Like, "That's so pathetic
that he just quit."
Copy !req
604. You're not good enough, got it?
Copy !req
605. You're not strong enough!
Copy !req
606. It's hard when you love someone,
but also see them being abusive to people.
Copy !req
607. I mean, he would go
from, like, screaming, um,
Copy !req
608. to being like,
"Oh, my God, did I scare you, baby?"
Copy !req
609. He would have
this little— little boy voice.
Copy !req
610. And it was just confusing, you know,
because I felt indebted to him.
Copy !req
611. Like, for me, he was my only ticket.
Copy !req
612. At this point,
the company was bleeding money.
Copy !req
613. And so a frequent theme
in the office was like,
Copy !req
614. "When is the ship gonna sink?"
Copy !req
615. "What thing is gonna do that?"
Copy !req
616. American Apparel
had this internal whisper network.
Copy !req
617. The entire factory
talked on AOL Messenger,
Copy !req
618. and we'd all go back and forth chatting.
Copy !req
619. And one day, I'm sitting at my computer,
and someone sends me a link,
Copy !req
620. saying, "Have you seen this?"
Copy !req
621. Back now at 814 with the woman
Copy !req
622. who is suing the CEO of American Apparel
for sexual harassment.
Copy !req
623. What the fuck?
Copy !req
624. Wait, what?
Copy !req
625. I don't wanna keep secret about this,
Copy !req
626. and especially when I know
there may be others out there like me.
Copy !req
627. The 42-year-old Canadian entrepreneur
Copy !req
628. is accused of bombarding her
with calls and texts
Copy !req
629. demanding she send him
sexually explicit photographs.
Copy !req
630. The allegations that landed on my desk
Copy !req
631. made me feel absolutely enraged.
Copy !req
632. I have two daughters,
Copy !req
633. and it just made me think
Copy !req
634. about, like, what
they could possibly experience
Copy !req
635. when they're in the workforce.
Copy !req
636. Initially, it was one woman,
that led to a second.
Copy !req
637. But in doing our due diligence,
Copy !req
638. we found other women who were claiming
they experienced the same thing.
Copy !req
639. The CEO of the popular fashion line
American Apparel
Copy !req
640. is facing
another sexual-harassment lawsuit.
Copy !req
641. I made it very clear for him to stop.
I said, "No, please don't touch me."
Copy !req
642. Charney says
he's simply an unorthodox executive
Copy !req
643. who's spoken openly
about having sexual relationships
Copy !req
644. with some of his workers.
Copy !req
645. Have you ever
sexually harassed an employee?
Copy !req
646. No.
Copy !req
647. One of the biggest issues
in filing these lawsuits
Copy !req
648. was that all the women
had signed these agreements.
Copy !req
649. They thought that this was the norm.
Copy !req
650. But it basically said,
Copy !req
651. "You will not say anything disparaging
about Dov Charney or American Apparel."
Copy !req
652. "And if you do file anything,
you have to go to arbitration."
Copy !req
653. "You waive your right to a jury.
You cannot be in court."
Copy !req
654. The company is saying
and Dov Charney is saying that you signed
Copy !req
655. a confidentiality agreement.
Copy !req
656. She was 17 years old when she signed that.
The more important question to ask is,
Copy !req
657. why is the company
so focused on confidentiality?
Copy !req
658. It made me wonder at the time.
Copy !req
659. Some of it, I felt like, you know,
Copy !req
660. hashtag, like— like,
Copy !req
661. like, #BelieveWomen and stuff.
Copy !req
662. But, also, at the same time,
Dov was like a father figure to me.
Copy !req
663. And so I kind of fell into this like,
Copy !req
664. "Oh my God, are they just trying
to get a quick buck out of him?"
Copy !req
665. Charney has never been found by any court
Copy !req
666. to have sexually harassed an employee.
Copy !req
667. And he says he's never paid any money
in the cases against him.
Copy !req
668. There's something disingenuine
about the claims.
Copy !req
669. Uh, first of all, they're— they're fake.
Copy !req
670. Second of all,
these claimants are being coached.
Copy !req
671. Third of all,
there's too much money involved
Copy !req
672. in terms of the amounts of money
that they're claiming.
Copy !req
673. And I feel
I'm prepared to take a polygraph.
Copy !req
674. I didn't personally see anything
Copy !req
675. that I felt like was him coercing anyone.
Copy !req
676. The company introduced us
to a group of high-level employees,
Copy !req
677. all women, who say
working for Dov Charney is a pleasure.
Copy !req
678. Dov's a really exciting person
to work with.
Copy !req
679. I think Dov's a brilliant man.
Copy !req
680. He's very loyal. I enjoy working for him.
Copy !req
681. It was kind of like,
"Oh, please," like, "Yes,
Copy !req
682. everyone knows
there's sexuality in the workplace."
Copy !req
683. I think it's a money grab.
That's what I think.
Copy !req
684. Basically, it got to the point
where everyone was joking about it.
Copy !req
685. I'm beautiful, all right?
Sex is beautiful.
Copy !req
686. Sluts are beautiful.
Copy !req
687. And if my employees don't like it,
you know what? Sue me!
Copy !req
688. I don't remember feeling
Copy !req
689. embarrassed or upset.
Copy !req
690. I felt like we all just went back to work.
Copy !req
691. One more shirt,
one more watch, one more whatever.
Copy !req
692. American Apparel CEO Dov Charney
is struggling to keep things afloat now,
Copy !req
693. losing $86 million in sales,
Copy !req
694. slapped with
a $250-million sex-abuse lawsuit.
Copy !req
695. After that,
it definitely started to feel different.
Copy !req
696. Dov was starting to get
much more angry, much more paranoid
Copy !req
697. about, kind of, who was on board
with him and who was not.
Copy !req
698. Okay, how many did you do in New York?
Copy !req
699. You should know 'em by heart. Moron!
Copy !req
700. I went from being golden-boy status
to, like, whipping boy.
Copy !req
701. He was constantly berating me
for something that I didn't do.
Copy !req
702. Chintzy dummy! Little fuck dummy!
Copy !req
703. We didn't see the glimmers
of, like, "He's making a joke,"
Copy !req
704. or, "He's being charismatic" anymore.
Copy !req
705. You fuckers are so shitty!
Copy !req
706. It was exclusively yelling.
Copy !req
707. I'm gonna fuck you over too.
Copy !req
708. I'm gonna fuck you!
Copy !req
709. He would freak the fuck out.
Like, he'd just punch holes in walls or...
Copy !req
710. You know, I watched him smash
one of those, like, wire trash cans,
Copy !req
711. just, like, hitting it against the ground
until it was like a smashed soda can.
Copy !req
712. Shame on you, little fuck!
Copy !req
713. And then he'd get, like, inches away
from your face and just slap himself.
Copy !req
714. He would, like, hit himself and say,
Copy !req
715. "I'm hitting myself
because I can't hit you."
Copy !req
716. Like, pretty much to the point
where he's about to bleed.
Copy !req
717. It was just really crazy
and really outlandish.
Copy !req
718. And he'd leave you
with this sort of, like,
Copy !req
719. "I feel like my boss
is gonna murder me or something."
Copy !req
720. Basically, it didn't feel safe
in his house anymore,
Copy !req
721. and so I left.
Copy !req
722. At that point, everyone I knew
worked for American Apparel.
Copy !req
723. All of my clothing was American Apparel.
Copy !req
724. I had a company phone.
I had a company computer.
Copy !req
725. I was, like, so in it
Copy !req
726. that I couldn't even see
outside of, like, anything.
Copy !req
727. I was, like, fully in.
Copy !req
728. Send him a picture of this assortment,
and then I want you to critique yourself.
Copy !req
729. Tell me what you were missing.
An admission.
Copy !req
730. - Okay.
- Okay? His name's Carson.
Copy !req
731. You don't have any calculator watches,
so go fuck yourself.
Copy !req
732. You're off, and you failed me.
Copy !req
733. I had been hearing Dov quote
The 48 Laws of Power
Copy !req
734. relentlessly for years.
Copy !req
735. I took it home with me just to, like,
Copy !req
736. "All right,
let's read through this thing."
Copy !req
737. Before I ever met Dov, I had heard
that he was obsessed with this book,
Copy !req
738. and so it felt like,
finally, I should take a look at it.
Copy !req
739. "Never teach them enough
so that they can do without you."
Copy !req
740. Dov loves that one, I'm sure.
Copy !req
741. "Keep your words vague,
but full of promise."
Copy !req
742. "Give your new disciples
rituals to perform."
Copy !req
743. "Ask them to make sacrifices
on your behalf."
Copy !req
744. "Become the focal point of such desire
by offering them a cause."
Copy !req
745. "Play into people's need to believe
and create a cult-like following."
Copy !req
746. How can I sell these?
Where— How are they gonna sell?
Copy !req
747. They don't have the sticker.
Copy !req
748. The sticker's three cents.
Copy !req
749. "Keep others in suspended terror."
Copy !req
750. "Cultivate an air of unpredictability."
Copy !req
751. Oh, wow, it's just wild,
Copy !req
752. 'cause I'd describe myself
as terrorized from him.
Copy !req
753. And he did it, he executed that perfectly.
Copy !req
754. It's villainous.
It's such a manipulative way of thinking.
Copy !req
755. "Learn to keep people dependent on you."
Copy !req
756. Maybe I should've read this book.
Copy !req
757. That's like the Cult Leader 101.
Copy !req
758. You just keep them a little bit hungry,
Copy !req
759. and then you're the one
Copy !req
760. that's only really feeding them
what they need,
Copy !req
761. and then you're able to control
that situation.
Copy !req
762. Gosh, hindsight is amazing.
Copy !req
763. It kinda makes me want to cry now.
It's scary. It's really... scary.
Copy !req
764. Was I so easily got by this?
Copy !req
765. I mean, I'm from, like,
essentially another cult.
Copy !req
766. I got— And once it—
Copy !req
767. It was like I was primed as a kid,
growing up like Mormon,
Copy !req
768. to then just swing to the other side
and basically go into the same thing.
Copy !req
769. Once I had seen the emperor
was wearing no clothes,
Copy !req
770. and that this was the tools
that were being used to manipulate me,
Copy !req
771. that's when I kind of had, like,
an awakening moment
Copy !req
772. of, "What the fuck am I doing?"
Copy !req
773. At this point, it was really fucked up,
but still, I was petrified to quit
Copy !req
774. because the things
he'd also say to me was,
Copy !req
775. "I'm gonna blacklist you,
Copy !req
776. so you'll never get a job
in this industry, in this town."
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777. "I know everybody."
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778. "I'll tell everyone you're shit
and suck at your job."
Copy !req
779. But then things started
to, like, come to a head,
Copy !req
780. and I don't even know what provoked it.
Copy !req
781. He just started to send these texts
about how I was fucking up the company
Copy !req
782. and, you know,
"It's all your fault and you're meek."
Copy !req
783. "You don't have the passion to care,
and I find it reprehensible."
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784. And then he sends an e-mail
to the company lawyer,
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785. and then copies, you know,
the retail director and me,
Copy !req
786. saying, like, "Effective Monday,
reduce EJ's salary by 25%."
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787. And that was it. The next morning, I quit.
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788. I started, kind of, putting my foot down
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789. about things
that I felt like were unreasonable.
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790. Like, I got like 25 phone calls from Dov
over this weekend, telling me to come in.
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791. And then I got phone calls
from some of the girls and other people,
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792. "Dov's trying to call you,"
and I was like, "I'm not answering."
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793. "I'm not gonna answer
until I get here on Monday."
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794. So I basically got myself fired,
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795. 'cause I knew that if I quit,
then he didn't have to pay me anything.
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796. There was a day
where I had not eaten anything all day,
Copy !req
797. and I was like,
"Dov, I," like, "I need a break."
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798. Dov said, "Get a pizza across the street.
Be back in five minutes."
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799. And I was like, "Dov, I need to eat
a real meal with, like, vegetables."
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800. Like, "I need— I need a minute."
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801. And Dov just lost it on me.
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802. And as he was yelling at me,
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803. I just watched, like, a Dov girl, um...
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804. bring him
a freshly cooked steak on a plate
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805. and set it in front of him.
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806. And I was just like,
"You've got to be kidding me."
Copy !req
807. And I just lost it on him.
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808. And, um, the next day,
his lawyer was like,
Copy !req
809. "I think it's better that you just end
your time with the company."
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810. I looked at the company.
Copy !req
811. It's a market cap
of less than $120 million.
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812. I mean, he has driven this company
absolutely into the ground.
Copy !req
813. The fact of the matter is
this board has the responsibility
Copy !req
814. to get to the bottom of this.
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815. After I'd gotten fired by Dov,
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816. I got this call
from an independent auditor
Copy !req
817. working for the board of directors,
Copy !req
818. and it started to become clear
that they were looking to get rid of Dov
Copy !req
819. and looking for information
to support that decision.
Copy !req
820. If someone wrote a book
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821. about fucking people over at all costs
to get where you need to get,
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822. and then you put him
on the board of directors,
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823. of course it's gonna come back
to bite you in the ass.
Copy !req
824. The investigators found a server
Copy !req
825. that Charney had been using
on company property
Copy !req
826. that contained e-mails, texts,
graphic sexual videos,
Copy !req
827. a lot of information
that was really damaging to him.
Copy !req
828. Now, these are all allegations.
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829. But there has been video
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830. where he was literally
running around naked in some room,
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831. I don't know if it was
his apartment or a hotel room,
Copy !req
832. while two of his female employees
were in the room with him.
Copy !req
833. I'm dancing right now.
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834. He was crossing all kinds of ethical,
potentially legal, lines and boundaries.
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835. Now, we have some evidence indicating
Copy !req
836. that he had some
inappropriate text exchanges
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837. with his employees.
Copy !req
838. That is— That's way beyond acceptable.
Copy !req
839. So... company has
to make pretty radical changes.
Copy !req
840. American Apparel's
controversial CEO and founder is out.
Copy !req
841. American Apparel
has terminated Dov Charney.
Copy !req
842. The company's board has fired him.
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843. Fuck yeah, fuck him.
He deserves to be fired.
Copy !req
844. I think he thinks, um,
terminating him is bad for the company,
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845. and we think terminating him
was the right thing to do.
Copy !req
846. I even cut out
the headline and the article,
Copy !req
847. and I taped it to my journal
Copy !req
848. because it was, like,
such an amazing moment,
Copy !req
849. and I wanted to remember that.
Copy !req
850. When he got fired,
I felt a sigh of relief.
Copy !req
851. But I also felt like I lost my family.
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852. It was really hard to wrap my head around.
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853. Yes, there was abuse.
There was also fun times.
Copy !req
854. And that's why it's so layered.
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855. I believe the ousting of Dov Charney
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856. was because the board saw
Copy !req
857. that these claims
happened over and over again
Copy !req
858. and, you know, they would be
subjected to further liability.
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859. The women who came forward
were very brave in my opinion.
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860. But because, unfortunately,
these arbitration agreements were signed,
Copy !req
861. they were silenced.
Copy !req
862. And so we had to do something.
It just could not continue.
Copy !req
863. My client is here to talk
about her real-life experience
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864. as to what happened to her.
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865. So we went up to the Capitol
to try to have the law changed
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866. so that employers
can no longer require employees
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867. to sign away their legal rights.
Copy !req
868. My entire employment
at this company was awful.
Copy !req
869. It was absolutely
earth-shatteringly dehumanizing
Copy !req
870. to be employed at this company.
Copy !req
871. It has taken me
close to eight years of unraveling
Copy !req
872. to undo and— and reflect
Copy !req
873. on all the things
that this man was allowed to take from me.
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874. What really pisses me off
is that he took my voice.
Copy !req
875. I'd love to tell you my story
Copy !req
876. and the details
of what happened to me at that company,
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877. but I'm not at liberty to do so.
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878. Knowing that, like, okay,
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879. he was capable
of, like, the— the screaming
Copy !req
880. and sometimes the physicality with me,
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881. I started to feel like
maybe he was capable
Copy !req
882. of the things
that he was getting accused of.
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883. I was 18
Copy !req
884. when I started working
at American Apparel.
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885. Dov invited me to LA
for a week-long merchandising training,
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886. which took place at his home.
Copy !req
887. He didn't allow me
to go back home and grab a suitcase.
Copy !req
888. He made it clear
that I was to stay at his house.
Copy !req
889. Dov invited me to his home,
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890. and when I got there,
he was just wearing his underwear.
Copy !req
891. Dov offered me
to model for American Apparel.
Copy !req
892. When I turned up,
he was wearing just a towel.
Copy !req
893. I found myself alone
with Dov in his bedroom.
Copy !req
894. He asked me
if I was an exhibitionist or a voyeur.
Copy !req
895. He dragged me inside
and forced me to give him oral sex.
Copy !req
896. And then he demanded
that I give him oral sex.
Copy !req
897. He tried to take photos
and then instantly attacked me,
Copy !req
898. forcing me to perform sexual acts.
Copy !req
899. He demanded I show him my breasts.
Copy !req
900. And when I said no,
he became more aggressive and violent.
Copy !req
901. He took me to the bedroom,
got on top of me,
Copy !req
902. and I almost suffocated
Copy !req
903. from him forcing me
to perform another sexual act.
Copy !req
904. He was old enough to be my father.
Copy !req
905. - He didn't let me leave.
- And tried to sodomize me.
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906. I was 18.
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907. Dov, he's gotten away with a lot,
Copy !req
908. and he will probably continue
to get away with a lot.
Copy !req
909. It's like people are different animals,
and that type of person is a predator.
Copy !req
910. So it'd be like a shark
or a rattlesnake or something,
Copy !req
911. and no amount
of being mad at a rattlesnake or a shark
Copy !req
912. will ever change what they are.
Copy !req
913. They're always going to bite.
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914. And it's incredibly frustrating
Copy !req
915. 'cause it's something that...
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916. for whatever reason, in society,
Copy !req
917. we've kind of just let
that type of person continue.
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918. If American Apparel
was successful as an extension of you,
Copy !req
919. what extension of you are we getting now?
Copy !req
920. The same one! I'm not sorry about shit.
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