1. There's this weird
thing that humans do.
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2. We take animals and we put
our words into their mouths
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3. to talk back to us, usually about us.
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4. It's a very strange thing,
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5. but we've done it for centuries.
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6. We learned to read from
anthropomorphic animals.
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7. We learn right from wrong
from anthropomorphic animals.
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8. But most people don't notice it.
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9. Furry fans are the people
who notice that we do this,
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10. and think that there's something
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11. really special about that.
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12. Well, like the dictionary
definition you get
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13. is furry is a community of people
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14. that enjoy anthropomorphic art, right?
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15. I feel like
it's way more than that.
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16. It's a social space that is largely queer,
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17. and gravitates around,
using art as the vehicle
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18. to explore identity.
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19. I sucked at drawing people,
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20. so I would draw animals and everything.
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21. I sort of anthropomorphized my own dog
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22. in a lot of my drawings, stuff like that.
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23. I was a part of a Lion
King archive online,
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24. and everybody role plays as lions.
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25. And I remember just thinking,
guys, the lions are great,
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26. but what if we were wolves?
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27. And they're like, ew, furry.
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28. And I was like, furry?
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29. I had my first word to get
to this feeling that I had.
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30. Yes, yeah, I did your shirt.
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31. I was initially into cosplay.
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32. I cosplayed a lot of anime characters.
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33. I'm not alone.
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34. There are other people out
there that are into this.
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35. I didn't come out fully, 'cause
furry was taboo back then.
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36. It's something weird, something odd.
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37. It doesn't help that
media never really had
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38. a positive point of view to begin with.
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39. But I'm always grateful
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40. for the friends that I've made
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41. and the people that
I've met along the way.
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42. It's just a fundamental part of who I am.
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43. So I'm not super familiar
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44. with the history of the fandom.
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45. I know, I think it originated
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46. out of a sci-fi convention in the 80s,
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47. and I want to say probably California.
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48. I was already known as
the science fiction geek
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49. of the family.
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50. The movie geek and the Disney geek.
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51. I've been all of these
things since I was a kid.
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52. I've been interested
IN science fiction fandom
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53. since the 1970s, when I went to
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54. my first Star Trek convention.
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55. I was a Navy brat.
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56. Our family would go to the movie theater
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57. at the Air Navy base in
St. Louis and watch films.
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58. One of the first times
I've ever been to a theater,
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59. my dad hated them.
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60. He much preferred drive-ins,
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61. but somehow we talked him into going
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62. to a sit down theater to see "Robin Hood."
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63. And I would fuss
and cry and squirm always,
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64. except in the movie "Bambi."
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65. I was immediately hooked.
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66. I was into that cartoon.
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67. I just loved animation.
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68. What it looked like and
also how it was done.
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69. I'm into it in a way
that my school friends aren't.
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70. I'm into it in a way
that my parents aren't.
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71. So what do I do?
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72. I was looking for fandom.
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73. A bunch of people getting together
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74. and geeking out with
each other about media.
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75. We traveled across the country
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76. and ended up moving to California in 1958.
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77. I live in Southern
California, close to Hollywood,
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78. the media capital of the world,
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79. or at least it was at the time.
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80. Background places, please.
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81. - This is lovely.
- Oh, it's lovely.
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82. Turn around, let's see your back.
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83. You had a nice
pose, want to try it again?
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84. LosCon 1980.
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85. The local Southern California
science fiction convention.
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86. That was the first convention
that I'd ever been to
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87. that had an art show.
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88. And it was beautiful.
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89. A lot of it was princesses
in flowing gowns,
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90. star fields that you'd see
on the side of someone's van.
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91. And a lot of it was
just absolutely amazing.
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92. But then here are these pictures
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93. of these semi-anthropomorphic
weasel characters
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94. with antennas like bugs.
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95. A friend of mine said,
Rodney, you gotta see these,
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96. 'cause they knew I wouldn't shut up
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97. about my enjoyment of mustelid characters.
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98. In school, I was considered
very weird for that.
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99. So I asked them at the art
show, who does this art?
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100. I had a video
room at LosCon seven
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101. showing some anime, some
science fiction TV shows.
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102. And this tall guy comes up and goes...
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103. Why do your pine martens have antennas?
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104. Oh my, this person recognizes
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105. the kind of animals I'm drawing.
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106. Most people thought they were cats.
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107. And I said, well, sit down
and I'll explain it to you.
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108. We loved Japanese animation
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109. and nobody knew about it
except for the few shows
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110. By 1977, myself and four other people,
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111. some of whom were
animators in the business,
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112. actually TV animators.
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113. We decided more people
should see this stuff
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114. and started a club.
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115. And it was the first anime club.
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116. The very first anime
fan club in America.
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117. A lot of the people
that came to the meetings
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118. were also into animal characters.
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119. Which is why the mascot of the club
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120. became one of my Skiltaire,
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121. which are sort of an alien
mammal based on weasels.
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122. Rodney would come to the screenings
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123. and we'd hang out and talk.
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124. And we saw each other more
and more and more after that.
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125. Here were two people
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126. who came from very different backgrounds,
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127. but we were paralleling each other
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128. amazingly on interests and passions.
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129. Movies, animation, novels, comics.
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130. And a few years later, we
decided to become a couple.
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131. Rod and Mark are effectively,
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132. the grandparents in the furry fandom.
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133. I consider them the parents
of the furry fandom,
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134. but I've also been in the furry fandom
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135. for 20 years at this point.
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136. The Prancing Skiltaire
household is like a museum
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137. and library of furry things.
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138. They had figurines all over the place.
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139. They have bookcases and
bookshelves of furry comics,
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140. of anime comics, of sci-fi.
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141. So this is San
Diego Comic Con one year.
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142. This is Don Bluth and Douglas Adams.
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143. Me.
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144. Remember they had
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145. - the live action muppet?
- The live action muppet show.
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146. There was lots and lots and lots
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147. of science fiction conventions.
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148. Ah yeah!
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149. We saw the birth of the comic book shop.
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150. In the 70s, it was a time when
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151. the Comics Code was
still heavily enforced,
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152. and so comic books all
had to be black and white,
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153. good and evil, superhero comics basically.
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154. But there were these groups of artists
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155. who were just chomping at the
bit to do something different,
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156. to do something, not superheroes,
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157. to do something Funny Animal.
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158. Funny Animal does not
mean animals that are funny.
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159. It means animals that are in the funnies.
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160. A lot of people think Funny Animal
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161. and think that it all has to go to kids,
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162. but a lot of it was being
consumed by adults as well,
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163. especially in the underground comic scene.
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164. Their sense of mischief,
their sense of uninhibitedness.
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165. I was sort of in a family where
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166. I don't think there
was a lot of elbow room
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167. for my exuberance, my imagination.
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168. And I think I projected a lot
of that into these stories,
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169. into these characters.
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170. And I think a good deal of identification
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171. developed from that.
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172. Funny Animal comics
used to be very popular
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173. before superheroes took off.
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174. And they had their own fandom.
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175. It was very spread and
had a lot of difficulty
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176. talking to each other in
the old pre-internet days.
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177. Now they've
been lost to obscurity.
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178. The fandom started... pretty much-
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179. Old folk tend to disagree
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180. on where exactly it began,
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181. but the commonly accepted starting point
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182. was a painting done by
the artist Steve Gallacci.
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183. He had created a character,
a furry character,
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184. a pilot in a futuristic spaceship.
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185. This piece was hanging up in an art show
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186. at an east coast science
fiction convention.
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187. Now what you have to understand is
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188. that hadn't been done before.
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189. A furry, an anthropomorphic character,
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190. was limited to a coyote
hitting the bottom of a cliff,
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191. standing up dusting himself off
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192. and going to the Acme catalog.
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193. He also
published one of the very first
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194. furry anthology comics, "Albedo."
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195. Steve had a whole world
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196. about these anthropomorphic
animals in outer space
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197. and their politics, and war
between different groups.
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198. It really caught people's imaginations.
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199. It was from discussion of his work
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200. that led to the very first furry party,
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201. directly led to the very
first furry party, actually.
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202. Cause they moved to discussion
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203. from in front of his art panel
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204. to a private room to
continue the discussion.
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205. It started out as gatherings of people
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206. in room parties at science
fiction conventions.
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207. His fans would
show up and he discuss
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208. this universe he'd created.
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209. And that was the beginning.
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210. That was around 1980 or there about.
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211. These room parties somehow
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212. got the name of furry parties.
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213. The term 'furry' had got
around and stuck enough
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214. that when we had another party
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215. at Westercon 1986 in San Diego,
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216. we decided to call it a furry party.
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217. All of these artists were amazed
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218. that there were other people out there
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219. drawing quote, unquote, Funny Animals
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220. in the way that they did.
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221. Someone would walk into our party,
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222. pull out a sketchbook and say,
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223. I was the only one I
thought that was drawing
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224. this kind of stuff.
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225. And that just kept
happening again and again.
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226. They had this same revelation as I did.
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227. I'm not the only one.
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228. I always thought I was weird.
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229. I always thought no one
else would understand.
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230. And here are people who are just like me.
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231. It was like a quest to find more people
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232. who like the same thing we liked.
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233. And it became the most
important thing in our lives.
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234. I wanted to jump up on
the Empire State Building
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235. and singing an aria about it.
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236. I thought we had stumbled
across something just so cool.
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237. Well, this is a classic Merlino.
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238. This is the AvantGarden
Gallery in downtown Santa Ana.
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239. It's part of their arts district.
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240. Mark and I have been hosting
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241. what we call the art of furry fandom,
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242. where we gather furry artists together
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243. and have them put their stuff on display
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244. along with all of this
quote, unquote regular art
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245. Here was our art show
and our sponsor lounge,
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246. couple of panel rooms here,
and a mini fursuit lounge.
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247. And then here was our game room.
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248. Hi, I'm Bubbles, I'm 25.
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249. I'm the convention chair for
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250. five different furry conventions,
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251. including DenFur here in Denver, Colorado.
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252. The hotel will give us this whole space
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253. and we choose how we use it.
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254. A little meet-and-greet area.
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255. Some board-gaming and then
our big, main events room.
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256. We have had hotels that are like,
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257. so I looked up this stuff
and what the heck is this?
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258. I mean, DenFur is like
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259. a celebration of the anthropomorphic arts.
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260. Well, I found furry probably, oh,
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261. probably junior high-ish.
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262. I didn't know what furry was yet.
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263. That was back in the days
of Neopets on the internet.
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264. I found all those message boards,
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265. and I'm like, these are my people.
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266. I guess I'm here.
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267. My parents, they always thought it was
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268. some weird kinky thing that like,
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269. what is my daughter doing?
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270. The fandom growing up was kind of a hobby,
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271. especially working as a medic.
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272. It was a side thing that I could do
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273. and enjoy outside of work.
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274. Now I run conventions.
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275. I mean, my life is the fandom,
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276. and I don't know where I
would be now without it.
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277. We had the creators,
the people that made art.
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278. They were fans of comic strips.
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279. They were fans of comic books
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280. and they were all aiming
to be in that business.
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281. Reed Waller started an
APA-zine called "Vootie."
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282. It had Funny Animals in it,
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283. but it was more of an
underground influence.
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284. APA, A-P-A, amateur press association.
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285. All the members of this APA-zine
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286. would make photocopies of their artwork
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287. and send it into the editor,
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288. who would compile the
entire book together,
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289. and then send a copy
out to all the members.
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290. And then you would get back,
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291. here's my work and 25 or 30 other works.
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292. This is how a lot of people
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293. over a large geographical area
got a chance to get feedback
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294. from other artists, authors, and creators.
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295. There was literally this giant culture
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296. of people who were talking to each other
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297. by writing into the letters columns
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298. of their favorite magazines.
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299. It was like the internet in slow motion.
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300. We were a very strange fandom.
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301. We didn't fully grasp how
strange we were going in,
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302. but we were not a fandom of a property,
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303. nor were we a fandom of a genre.
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304. Other fandoms would look at
us and get extremely confused.
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305. What are you about?
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306. WHO are you about?
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307. All of those specificities don't matter.
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308. It's the overarching:
animals-doing-things-
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309. that-animals-don't-do, thing,
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310. that binds this all together.
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311. Beyond that, it can be anything.
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312. Probably the earliest
furry work I would talk about
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313. is a Omaha the Cat Dancer,
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314. which exists because Taral
Wayne who was fairly influential
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315. in the early furry fandom
wrote a letter to "Vootie."
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316. In response, Kate Worley and Reed Waller
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317. came up with Omaha the cat dancer,
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318. which is about a exotic
pole-dancing feline
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319. and her boyfriend and
sometimes girlfriend.
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320. It gets a complicated storyline sometimes.
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321. It was story with drama,
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322. it was a story with realistic action,
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323. with character motivations.
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324. Omaha was widely acclaimed
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325. as a great pro-feminist comic as well
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326. because it showed a female main character
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327. in control of her own destiny,
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328. and she didn't let society
decide what she wanted.
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329. We had all quietly discovered
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330. that part of what brought
us to furry characters,
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331. anthropomorphic characters,
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332. was that we thought they could be sexy.
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333. It seemed kind of obvious
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334. when you saw some of these characters
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335. and how they were designed
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336. that they were intended to be sexy.
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337. We felt we were just kind of
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338. jumping on a big existing bandwagon.
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339. The very first conventions I ever went to,
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340. there were erotic
material of every fandom.
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341. So of course, furry is full of sexuality
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342. because furry is full of human beings
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343. who are alive and thinking and feeling.
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344. Ken Sample quite often would draw
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345. this little cougar guy that
looked an awful lot like Ken.
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346. We started calling that
character Ken Cougar.
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347. We thought, hey, we should
have our own character too
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348. that's actually us.
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349. This was a big shift in the fandom.
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350. We went from fans of animal
people to being animal people.
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351. This created an
explosion in art demand.
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352. A fursona is someone's
character that represents them.
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353. That may be how they see themselves.
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354. It may be an aspirational character,
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355. what they wish they were
or would like to become.
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356. As an artist, it involves kind of
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357. getting inside their head and figuring out
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358. what is it that their fursona is saying?
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359. Who is this person,
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360. and what part of this human
is this furry character,
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361. this fursona that you're designing?
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362. When you can figure that
out and you show them
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363. the final piece of art and they're like,
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364. oh my gosh, that's perfect.
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365. That's just like the
greatest thing in the world.
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366. Because a lot of people,
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367. their furry character is
the better version of them.
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368. This would be me if I
didn't have these problems
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369. or these things, this is the best of me.
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370. Cause everyone likes to think of animals
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371. as being more pure and more
innocent and stuff like that,
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372. 'cause humans can do
some pretty dark things.
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373. Granted, so do animals in the real world.
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374. But we're not getting into
that, this is fantasy.
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375. At least that's how I
always interpreted it.
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376. That, and I think some people just thought
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377. certain animals are cute.
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378. Everybody wanted
pictures of their fursonas.
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379. We started getting
together discussion groups.
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380. What is your fursona?
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381. My earliest character was a kangaroo
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382. named White Death because I was 13
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383. and I was super edgy.
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384. I chose a husky.
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385. They were always my favorite dog,
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386. and the personality wise
of a husky is basically me.
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387. I really like border collies
cause they're super smart,
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388. and then I was like, but I need
to be ferocious like a wolf.
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389. It is a border Collie wolf character.
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390. His name was Kiguel, and
I had stolen the name
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391. from an exchange student
that was at my school.
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392. I think people join furry
because of how encouraging
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393. it is of exploring yourself,
understanding yourself
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394. and expressing it.
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395. I've been drawing for
as long as I can remember.
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396. I just picked it up as a
kid and didn't really stop.
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397. I'd say I identify a lot with birds.
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398. I'm pretty quiet, and a
little bit shy or flighty.
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399. I deal with social anxiety
and things like that.
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400. I feel like I have one
foot in the furry fandom
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401. and one foot in fantasy illustration.
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402. There's a humanness that
you can impart to animals
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403. or dragons or anything like that,
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404. where there's that ability to
relate to what you're seeing,
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405. even though what you're
seeing is fantastical.
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406. I think that's really powerful.
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407. I started doing conventions
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408. to go and sell my work and show it.
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409. I love it a lot more than just doing
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410. like a mainstream comic convention
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411. where it's all people celebrating
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412. other intellectual properties
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413. that are technically corporate.
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414. I can't wait to do that talk
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415. with you tonight at 10:00 PM.
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416. One of the things I really love
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417. about the fandom is
how many people find it
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418. to be their path out of their shell.
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419. I started looking at all
the different suits and stuff
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420. on Google search and they
just looked so unique
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421. and just fascinated me.
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422. And I was like, I can do that.
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423. I really wanna to do that.
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424. And this is another creative
outlet that I can use.
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425. And I wanted to make my
own character come to life
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426. and be one of those fursuits.
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427. I remember wearing my Luna
suit for the first time.
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428. I ran into so many people
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429. that wanted to take pictures with me.
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430. And it was just really
exciting to like go around
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431. and have fun in fursuit with
other people in fursuit.
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432. Ta-da!
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433. You can look at their character
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434. and learn things about
them in that very moment.
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435. Like what their species choice is,
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436. what sort of colors they're
using, what their name is.
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437. That's all broadcasting a lot of things
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438. that they want you to know about them.
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439. And they might not even realize
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440. what they're sending out subconsciously.
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441. Usually when I go to make a suit,
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442. everything from gender to height
Copy !req
443. plays a role in creating
these characters for people.
Copy !req
444. And it's actually really
fun to help them explore
Copy !req
445. this whole new character
that they're creating.
Copy !req
446. I think you're
in... I think you're in focus.
Copy !req
447. We had been going to BayCon,
Copy !req
448. and the anime fans were
taking over the convention.
Copy !req
449. The people running the convention
Copy !req
450. kind of politely said could you guys maybe
Copy !req
451. get your own convention because
Copy !req
452. this is science fiction and
it's becoming all anime.
Copy !req
453. Rodney and I said, gee.
Copy !req
454. Maybe we could have a furry
convention just for furries.
Copy !req
455. So we started looking around
for a hotel local to us.
Copy !req
456. We weren't coming in there
with a corporate credit card
Copy !req
457. laying it down and say
this pays for everything.
Copy !req
458. If I signed the contract with the hotel,
Copy !req
459. I was liable to pay the hotel.
Copy !req
460. I will admit I was young and
had kind of stars in my eyes.
Copy !req
461. I think we had a crew of like, five,
Copy !req
462. counting Mark and myself
for running everything.
Copy !req
463. We'd been tossing names around.
Copy !req
464. And I had the idea, how about conference
Copy !req
465. except put a U of an E?
Copy !req
466. ConFurence.
Copy !req
467. That's the name we picked.
Copy !req
468. We numbered the first convention 'zero'.
Copy !req
469. Because we weren't certain
it was going to work.
Copy !req
470. So we said to ourselves, let's get crazy.
Copy !req
471. If we're going to put
on our own conventions,
Copy !req
472. let's try and do some things differently.
Copy !req
473. One of the big things
that you will always find
Copy !req
474. in the history of science
fiction conventions
Copy !req
475. is the Saturday night masquerade.
Copy !req
476. It was the big event.
Copy !req
477. They weren't professionally
lit in any way, shape, or form.
Copy !req
478. All of us myopic fans with
their glasses could see
Copy !req
479. these glowing blobs
sauntering down the stage.
Copy !req
480. Yeah, I guess that looks pretty.
Copy !req
481. We thought it'd be great
Copy !req
482. if people could actually see the costumes.
Copy !req
483. Maybe even close up.
Copy !req
484. Is this a little better?
Copy !req
485. Is this is a little better?
Copy !req
486. - Yeah.
- All right, okay.
Copy !req
487. Okay, we'll begin with
Copy !req
488. the first.
Copy !req
489. Back then, art show was the biggest thing.
Copy !req
490. The art shows were always popular
Copy !req
491. and always made a lot of
money for the artists.
Copy !req
492. We wanted to make furry
conventions smart and fun.
Copy !req
493. You wanted to come to learn stuff,
Copy !req
494. you could learn stuff.
Copy !req
495. If you wanted to come
to hang and be friends,
Copy !req
496. you could hang and be friends.
Copy !req
497. January of '91, a friend of mine and I
Copy !req
498. drove 44 hours straight
from Tampa to SoCal
Copy !req
499. to ConFurence 2 in Anaheim.
Copy !req
500. It was a completely new experience.
Copy !req
501. My first trip out of the time zone.
Copy !req
502. Seeing hills for the first time,
Copy !req
503. then mountains for the
first time, and then snow.
Copy !req
504. Just a completely new thing,
Copy !req
505. throwing me completely out of my element.
Copy !req
506. Just sheltered shy college
kid, and next thing you know,
Copy !req
507. I'm in California amongst
several hundred furries.
Copy !req
508. These comic artists that
I'd seen in fanzines
Copy !req
509. and black and white comics,
Copy !req
510. they're right there in front of me.
Copy !req
511. And they're just, they're just people.
Copy !req
512. I was learning art myself
and drawing from time to time
Copy !req
513. and next thing you know,
Copy !req
514. I'm a writing for the first six issues
Copy !req
515. of a magazine called "Yarf!"
Copy !req
516. There's been some
footage floating around
Copy !req
517. that's just adorable.
Copy !req
518. Terrible 80s hair, the 80s fashion.
Copy !req
519. And it was very clear that
these people were having fun.
Copy !req
520. Shop around
for your material.
Copy !req
521. There are places out
there that will sell you,
Copy !req
522. charge you a fortune.
Copy !req
523. They've found a place to
start exploring who they were
Copy !req
524. at a time and a place that
Copy !req
525. they never had been able to before.
Copy !req
526. It was very inclusive and very welcoming
Copy !req
527. and became sex-positive.
Copy !req
528. Not that it was about sex,
but that when sex happened,
Copy !req
529. it was generally viewed favorably.
Copy !req
530. It wasn't dirty, wasn't wrong.
Copy !req
531. It was just sex.
Copy !req
532. And people have sex and that's fine.
Copy !req
533. It's the
Rod O'Reilly master mix
Copy !req
534. at ConFurence Zero.
Copy !req
535. We were fully prepared for
it to fall flat on its face
Copy !req
536. and cost us a bunch of money.
Copy !req
537. And then say, well, that was a great idea.
Copy !req
538. Let's try something else.
Copy !req
539. But it worked.
Copy !req
540. It gave me a
feeling of accomplishment.
Copy !req
541. We were onto something and we said,
Copy !req
542. let's take this football and run with it.
Copy !req
543. And we did.
Copy !req
544. Can you test it, see if it sounds okay?
Copy !req
545. The con chair is always
the one in the spotlight.
Copy !req
546. People think we're the only
one making the decision.
Copy !req
547. This whole team of 60 to 100 people
Copy !req
548. put in months and months of
work to put on this show.
Copy !req
549. We can't run it with five people.
Copy !req
550. It wouldn't happen, there's no way.
Copy !req
551. Boiler to Truffle.
Copy !req
552. The thing that I didn't know was
Copy !req
553. how many small moving parts there are.
Copy !req
554. What time things open,
what time things close,
Copy !req
555. when things finally get locked down.
Copy !req
556. And how many people it takes
to put on something like this.
Copy !req
557. Usually set up starts right
after the last one ended.
Copy !req
558. We start putting things in place.
Copy !req
559. We started listening to feedback.
Copy !req
560. We started approving things.
Copy !req
561. It's a very, very complex machine.
Copy !req
562. This is A1 corgi to A1... uh,
Copy !req
563. whatever your species is, Bubbles.
Copy !req
564. There's a ton of different departments.
Copy !req
565. We have a business
director, events director,
Copy !req
566. operations director, marketing,
and public relations.
Copy !req
567. Theming, our HR managers.
Copy !req
568. IT and AV work, so all the
sound and lighting that you see.
Copy !req
569. Things like dealer's den,
Copy !req
570. which is a vendor space,
Copy !req
571. requires hand-choosing the dealers.
Copy !req
572. And we go through 400
applications every single year.
Copy !req
573. There's only two
female convention chairs
Copy !req
574. in the entire fandom.
Copy !req
575. And we have one and we're proud of that.
Copy !req
576. I graduated as an EMT
and from high school
Copy !req
577. at the same time and worked my butt off
Copy !req
578. to get to paramedic
school as soon as I could.
Copy !req
579. The president of that program
sat me down in an office
Copy !req
580. and said, look, you're
going to be the only woman
Copy !req
581. in this class.
Copy !req
582. I think you should leave.
Copy !req
583. Just being able to overcome
that in that profession,
Copy !req
584. also coming to furry has
made a big difference
Copy !req
585. 'cause in the convention leadership world,
Copy !req
586. there's not a lot of women.
Copy !req
587. It is still extremely male dominated.
Copy !req
588. A lot of people in the 9-1-1
first responder profession
Copy !req
589. hurt their back.
Copy !req
590. And that's unfortunately
what happened to me.
Copy !req
591. I wasn't allowed to do that job anymore.
Copy !req
592. I do miss medicine,
Copy !req
593. but I get a lot of the same
gratification out of this.
Copy !req
594. Okay, yeah, so there's
the con store stuff...
Copy !req
595. so I can get the GoH...
Copy !req
596. The computer, the network,
Copy !req
597. the mass communication revolution
Copy !req
598. is what made furry fandom take off.
Copy !req
599. A whole lot of people who
are furries are in IT.
Copy !req
600. But it was the realm
of the military and colleges
Copy !req
601. that were the only
people who knew about it.
Copy !req
602. Eventually the college peoples went home
Copy !req
603. and took a lot of the
computer stuff with them.
Copy !req
604. And then along came ARPANET,
FidoNet, bulletin boards,
Copy !req
605. the proto internet.
Copy !req
606. A bulletin board service.
Copy !req
607. You had to dial in to this central network
Copy !req
608. and you could post text, pictures.
Copy !req
609. The pictures was the painful part
Copy !req
610. because it would take about
30 minutes to download it.
Copy !req
611. And you would see the cursor
rendering across the screen,
Copy !req
612. every line of pixels.
Copy !req
613. It was only a week until
you got a reply to your post
Copy !req
614. instead of a month.
Copy !req
615. Hey, life improves.
Copy !req
616. People today take it for granted.
Copy !req
617. Back then, this was new.
Copy !req
618. This was unheard of.
Copy !req
619. This was Star Trek stuff.
Copy !req
620. It gave people a chance
Copy !req
621. to do role play as their characters.
Copy !req
622. When I was just coming out of college
Copy !req
623. and I was starting to work,
Copy !req
624. the internet was a very small place.
Copy !req
625. We think of it as this
big thing of global data,
Copy !req
626. but really, there wasn't as much out there
Copy !req
627. as people think there was,
Copy !req
628. and there weren't the browsers.
Copy !req
629. So we were using things
like Gopher and Mosaic
Copy !req
630. and all kinds of weird technology
Copy !req
631. that doesn't exist anymore.
Copy !req
632. A bunch of
people would get together
Copy !req
633. on a computer system,
Copy !req
634. form characters and go
on an adventure together.
Copy !req
635. They started calling these things
Copy !req
636. multi-user dungeons, MUDs.
Copy !req
637. It would say you are now in a room
Copy !req
638. that is this big, it's colored
red, it's made of brick,
Copy !req
639. and there is a dragon sitting there
Copy !req
640. that's going to eat your face.
Copy !req
641. Other gathering started
that were entirely social.
Copy !req
642. They didn't want to
continue using the word MUD
Copy !req
643. because that still had
that dungeon connotation.
Copy !req
644. So they started calling them MUCKS.
Copy !req
645. With the online communities,
Copy !req
646. particularly Furry MUCK
that started in 1990,
Copy !req
647. people were getting to know each other
Copy !req
648. and they would go to
conventions to meet each other.
Copy !req
649. Excuse
me, are you THE Karno?
Copy !req
650. Yes.
Copy !req
651. Hi, I'm THE Joe Strike.
Copy !req
652. Hey, hiya, Joe.
Copy !req
653. Oh yeah,
shake right there you go.
Copy !req
654. I'm Mutie on Furry MUCK.
Copy !req
655. This is Chirik, who also is on furry MUCK.
Copy !req
656. And it became more
about meeting each other
Copy !req
657. and having this sense of community
Copy !req
658. beyond just people
centered around creators.
Copy !req
659. That's how I first found that there was
Copy !req
660. an organized furry fandom.
Copy !req
661. The community was, was
my solace, my salvation.
Copy !req
662. I was not very happy where I was.
Copy !req
663. The South side of Chicago at the time.
Copy !req
664. I spent a very, very long year there.
Copy !req
665. There we go, we got furries.
Copy !req
666. And somebody mentioned
Copy !req
667. that there was a convention coming up
Copy !req
668. in Southern California called ConFurence.
Copy !req
669. Maybe you should go.
Copy !req
670. I said, I'm a postdoc at this
point, I don't have any money.
Copy !req
671. I called my dear and sainted mother.
Copy !req
672. Kids, never lie to your mom.
Copy !req
673. I told my mom the truth.
Copy !req
674. I'd like to go to a
conference in California,
Copy !req
675. but the professor won't pay for it.
Copy !req
676. That's a true statement.
Copy !req
677. So she sent me the money
to go to the conference.
Copy !req
678. And that was my first furry convention.
Copy !req
679. Now, I had been going to
science fiction conventions
Copy !req
680. for 10 years.
Copy !req
681. I've been volunteering at them.
Copy !req
682. I was a convention goer.
Copy !req
683. But this was the first time
Copy !req
684. that it was a convention that was entirely
Copy !req
685. of interest to me.
Copy !req
686. And started going to furry conventions
Copy !req
687. every year after that.
Copy !req
688. Uncle Kage.
Copy !req
689. Uncle Kage.
Copy !req
690. Uncle Kage slash Sam Conway.
Copy !req
691. He's very charismatic.
Copy !req
692. He's very funny.
Copy !req
693. He had this sort of mad
scientist kind of persona,
Copy !req
694. So you're gonna create,
Copy !req
695. you're gonna create real furries?
Copy !req
696. I am, as a matter of fact.
Copy !req
697. And how
are you gonna do that?
Copy !req
698. Well, it's quite simple.
Copy !req
699. You see the a, you take the,
Copy !req
700. Oh yeah.
Copy !req
701. I was sitting in the lobby,
Copy !req
702. and I was telling somebody a story.
Copy !req
703. It's in my nature
Copy !req
704. As Mary Shelley said,
Copy !req
705. if you make the creature
a gigantic statue,
Copy !req
706. you have a much easier time
Copy !req
707. in dealing with the parts, you see.
Copy !req
708. And they simply said,
Copy !req
709. would you come back next year
Copy !req
710. and do that as an event?
Copy !req
711. What?
Copy !req
712. Complain about my job?
Copy !req
713. And they said, yeah.
Copy !req
714. I said, oh, I can do that, sure.
Copy !req
715. So I stood up in the lobby
Copy !req
716. and complained about my job for an hour.
Copy !req
717. Well, he was
kind of doing standup
Copy !req
718. that was slice of life.
Copy !req
719. People loved his stories.
Copy !req
720. He was already getting a
reputation for his performances.
Copy !req
721. And we were just thrilled
to have him at our show.
Copy !req
722. And that was 25 or so years ago.
Copy !req
723. And people still fly me all over the world
Copy !req
724. to get up on stage and talk.
Copy !req
725. That's all I do.
Copy !req
726. I don't understand it.
Copy !req
727. I just do it and they
keep inviting me back,
Copy !req
728. so I must be doing something right.
Copy !req
729. After Furry MUCK,
Copy !req
730. almost all the furries
were college students.
Copy !req
731. This tripled our attendance.
Copy !req
732. Since we had all of the
role players coming in,
Copy !req
733. all the college students
coming into the fandom,
Copy !req
734. the gender of the content began to shift.
Copy !req
735. You had a lot more males,
Copy !req
736. you had a lot more lesbian
couples and gay couples.
Copy !req
737. People don't realize it.
Copy !req
738. But back in the 60s and 70s,
Copy !req
739. there wasn't that much of a gay community.
Copy !req
740. Where could you go for companionship?
Copy !req
741. Some place where you had an equal chance
Copy !req
742. of getting your teeth kicked
in or getting arrested.
Copy !req
743. Right about the time
that furry fandom was hitting
Copy !req
744. was right about the time
that the AIDS crisis hit.
Copy !req
745. I know people who
lost dozens of friends.
Copy !req
746. An awful lot of people had
to come out of the closet
Copy !req
747. and get active for their own survival.
Copy !req
748. There was in fact, an LGBT
contingent in the furries.
Copy !req
749. We're going to celebrate
both of those at once.
Copy !req
750. I still remember how I felt
when I joined the fandom,
Copy !req
751. like when I was like a teenager
Copy !req
752. and I had no idea if I was queer or not.
Copy !req
753. And I thought I was really
scared to talk about it.
Copy !req
754. And I couldn't tell my friends.
Copy !req
755. High school was rough.
Copy !req
756. High school was rough.
Copy !req
757. I was pretty socially isolated,
I was nerdy, I was bullied.
Copy !req
758. The community around me at the time
Copy !req
759. was not queer friendly,
or even art friendly.
Copy !req
760. Doing art's really vulnerable.
Copy !req
761. Like if you put something on the page,
Copy !req
762. then you probably did that for a reason.
Copy !req
763. About midway through college,
Copy !req
764. I started questioning my gender
Copy !req
765. and eventually transitioned.
Copy !req
766. And that was a very
powerful time of my life,
Copy !req
767. where I got to really re-sort my identity
Copy !req
768. as this purpose-driven person.
Copy !req
769. When I started to transition,
Copy !req
770. I actually explored the
identity first with my character
Copy !req
771. to see, I guess, if it felt right
Copy !req
772. to become more masculine.
Copy !req
773. It was no longer Luna.
Copy !req
774. It was now the masculine Nate.
Copy !req
775. And it's really helped me explore
Copy !req
776. what parts of myself I wanted to be
Copy !req
777. as more trans masculine versus, you know,
Copy !req
778. the meek female. I used to be.
Copy !req
779. A safe place to explore the transition
Copy !req
780. without transitioning myself first.
Copy !req
781. Trans experiences are
just human experiences.
Copy !req
782. Ultimately, furry is also
about human experiences.
Copy !req
783. Once I discovered the fandom,
Copy !req
784. I could chat with people online.
Copy !req
785. I could express my creativity.
Copy !req
786. I could make friends.
Copy !req
787. Well, I can actually talk about
Copy !req
788. being queer without being worried
Copy !req
789. that people make fun of me.
Copy !req
790. What better place is there
Copy !req
791. to put yourself out there and say,
Copy !req
792. hey, this is how, I'd like
to be seen or treated.
Copy !req
793. And people will meet you on your own terms
Copy !req
794. in a way that you just
don't get anywhere else.
Copy !req
795. The dealer room closes at eight,
Copy !req
796. they could just be right closing up.
Copy !req
797. The first three ConFurences,
Copy !req
798. everyone who showed up
Copy !req
799. was someone that I knew
personally by name.
Copy !req
800. Very nice, keep it up.
Copy !req
801. We realized that the con
Copy !req
802. had gotten so large that we
didn't know everyone by name.
Copy !req
803. Pull like that, pull the mask down
Copy !req
804. against your cheeks.
Copy !req
805. This'll be
interesting to watch some day.
Copy !req
806. If you asked who we were
and could you point at us,
Copy !req
807. they wouldn't know.
Copy !req
808. And that was perfectly fine.
Copy !req
809. But it was always about this thing.
Copy !req
810. It was not about us.
Copy !req
811. We never wanted to be celebrities.
Copy !req
812. So they were very, very few fursuiters.
Copy !req
813. There was only, I think, maybe one or two
Copy !req
814. at the earliest furry conventions.
Copy !req
815. The suiting was almost nonexistent.
Copy !req
816. People would just paint their bodies.
Copy !req
817. And that was it.
Copy !req
818. One of them
is Hilda the Bambioid,
Copy !req
819. created and performed by Robert Hill.
Copy !req
820. I see we
have a bambioid there.
Copy !req
821. Hello, bambioid.
Copy !req
822. You could pretty much say
Copy !req
823. that it was the original fursuit.
Copy !req
824. Oopsie, hello, how you doing?
Copy !req
825. I was part of the burgeoning
fursuiting community.
Copy !req
826. You can make your own mascot.
Copy !req
827. That was mind blowing.
Copy !req
828. For your
consideration for ConFurence eight
Copy !req
829. favorite costume is...
Copy !req
830. The convention ConFurence grew
Copy !req
831. to be the largest convention in its day,
Copy !req
832. over a thousand people,
Copy !req
833. which was huge for the time.
Copy !req
834. But then there was negative
publicity about it.
Copy !req
835. And I'm not sure how much detail
Copy !req
836. you want to get into about that.
Copy !req
837. Da da da da da da.
Copy !req
838. We did have some
incidents at conventions
Copy !req
839. where there were people
getting completely drunk
Copy !req
840. coming out into the convention
and causing trouble.
Copy !req
841. Or in some cases getting
stoned out of their mind
Copy !req
842. and having to be taken off the property.
Copy !req
843. In the very early days,
Copy !req
844. a furry convention was,
an unintentional pun,
Copy !req
845. a rather wild and untamed unfair.
Copy !req
846. Yeah!
Copy !req
847. There was not a lot of
attention paid to public decorum,
Copy !req
848. and people are out there to have fun.
Copy !req
849. They were letting themselves go.
Copy !req
850. Let's just be crazy.
Copy !req
851. That's fun and that's fine,
Copy !req
852. if you keep in mind that
you're still in a public venue.
Copy !req
853. Folks tended to forget that.
Copy !req
854. Rod.
Copy !req
855. Oh my god,
Copy !req
856. it's the psychedelic Cousin Itt!
Copy !req
857. The bidding starts at $20.
Copy !req
858. Well, let's see now.
Copy !req
859. Should I talk about the
semen in the elevator?
Copy !req
860. No, I don't know if
there's any truth to that.
Copy !req
861. I think there were people
Copy !req
862. who wanted to give the
furs a bad reputation,
Copy !req
863. and I think a lot of this
misinformation was spread.
Copy !req
864. But there might've been people
Copy !req
865. who felt a little too liberated.
Copy !req
866. This caused us to have to do something
Copy !req
867. we didn't think was necessary.
Copy !req
868. We had to put rules of
conduct in our program book.
Copy !req
869. And we were criticized.
Copy !req
870. Why didn't you have rules of conduct
Copy !req
871. from the very beginning?
Copy !req
872. Because we didn't think
people were that stupid.
Copy !req
873. Okay, Here we go.
Copy !req
874. And when we had 200, 300,
400 people, we'd have problems.
Copy !req
875. Their twist on it was yeah,
Copy !req
876. Mark and Rodney allow that
kind of stuff at conventions.
Copy !req
877. I remember when I was
working at Disney television
Copy !req
878. in the mid 90s.
Copy !req
879. The executives at Disney
and at the other studios
Copy !req
880. knew about furries,
Copy !req
881. but they did not particularly
like the furries.
Copy !req
882. Some furry artists have been turned away
Copy !req
883. because of the people
that are interviewing
Copy !req
884. that heard about these furry conventions.
Copy !req
885. And interestingly, it wasn't
Copy !req
886. just because of the adult material.
Copy !req
887. It was also because they saw people
Copy !req
888. trading art back and forth freely.
Copy !req
889. And they did not like the idea
Copy !req
890. of property being freely
exchanged like that.
Copy !req
891. It was kind of a professional hazard
Copy !req
892. to let anyone know that you were involved
Copy !req
893. with the furry fandom.
Copy !req
894. I had snuck away to go to
ConFurence for the weekend.
Copy !req
895. And two of my coworkers had
apparently shadowed the con
Copy !req
896. and seen me there.
Copy !req
897. As soon as I came into work,
Copy !req
898. they popped in my
cubicle and started going
Copy !req
899. furry, furry.
Copy !req
900. And I was like, oh my god.
Copy !req
901. I mean, they've been there themselves,
Copy !req
902. So what could they say?
Copy !req
903. You guys here
for a convention of your own?
Copy !req
904. Yeah.
Copy !req
905. - Computers?
- Marketing.
Copy !req
906. Whoa, even better.
Copy !req
907. There was a large fandom
out here in California,
Copy !req
908. And there was also one back east,
Copy !req
909. kind of around New York.
Copy !req
910. There had been an attempt to start up
Copy !req
911. an east coast furry convention,
Copy !req
912. 'cause in the United
States, there was ConFurence
Copy !req
913. in Southern California, and that was it.
Copy !req
914. So in 1997, they started Albany Anthrocon.
Copy !req
915. I went because it was only four hours away
Copy !req
916. from Philadelphia.
Copy !req
917. I could drive there instead
of flying across the country.
Copy !req
918. It was obviously a first
year con, kind of cute.
Copy !req
919. As I said, I had been volunteering
Copy !req
920. at science fiction conventions for years.
Copy !req
921. And I was approached by one
of their committee members
Copy !req
922. who said, would you be our
guest of honor next year?
Copy !req
923. As the convention was coming up,
Copy !req
924. they had an email list for staff members.
Copy !req
925. A longstanding problem that I have is
Copy !req
926. I have a tendency to stick my nose in
Copy !req
927. whether it's wanted or not.
Copy !req
928. Things were coming across the mailing list
Copy !req
929. and I'm going, hmm.
Copy !req
930. And I would hesitantly type out
Copy !req
931. are you guys really sure
you want to do that?
Copy !req
932. You see Philcon tried this in, in 1984,
Copy !req
933. and here, here, this, this list
of terrible things happened
Copy !req
934. and they swore high and low
they'd never do that again.
Copy !req
935. If you do this, that would
get around those problems.
Copy !req
936. Then they started asking my advice.
Copy !req
937. Well, how would you run this?
Copy !req
938. What would you do here?
Copy !req
939. How should we do the following?
Copy !req
940. They're honest questions,
so I answered honestly.
Copy !req
941. As the convention date was approaching,
Copy !req
942. there was a concern over the finances.
Copy !req
943. The chairman of the convention realized
Copy !req
944. that we are probably going to
completely lose our shirts.
Copy !req
945. We're going to have to shut this down.
Copy !req
946. Some of the staff members
came to me and said,
Copy !req
947. would you take over?
Copy !req
948. And I said, this is all kind
of happening awful fast, folks.
Copy !req
949. First off, I'm your guest of honor.
Copy !req
950. It looks kind of bad if I'm
also your chairman that year.
Copy !req
951. Okay, I'm willing to do it
because I want to help out.
Copy !req
952. It's a good little convention.
Copy !req
953. You guys are really gung ho.
Copy !req
954. I'm happy to do it.
Copy !req
955. But it's gonna have to
be done differently.
Copy !req
956. You can't run it like
a bunch of college kids
Copy !req
957. having a party anymore.
Copy !req
958. If you want this to succeed
and have another year,
Copy !req
959. you're going to have to
run it as a business.
Copy !req
960. Tell us all
about Albany Anthrocon.
Copy !req
961. Albany Anthrocon no longer exists.
Copy !req
962. It's now become?
Copy !req
963. It's simply become Anthrocon,
the Furry Revolution.
Copy !req
964. We moved to the place that it all began.
Copy !req
965. The Hilton Valley Forge.
Copy !req
966. That's where the Declaration
of Independence was signed.
Copy !req
967. - Actually in the Hilton?
- In the Hilton.
Copy !req
968. - Signed in the Hilton?
- Signed in the Hilton.
Copy !req
969. Will you turn that off already?
Copy !req
970. So these people don't know.
Copy !req
971. Finally, in 1999, I attended
Copy !req
972. my very first furry convention,
which was Anthrocon.
Copy !req
973. That was one of the first major things
Copy !req
974. I'd ever traveled to by myself.
Copy !req
975. There were probably all of 30
events for the entire weekend.
Copy !req
976. But for me, that was a lot to do.
Copy !req
977. And this guy just came down.
Copy !req
978. He said, you look troubled
my friend, what's wrong?
Copy !req
979. And I was like, well, I
just don't know what to
Copy !req
980. make of all this.
Copy !req
981. He put his arm around me and he said,
Copy !req
982. I want you to take a
look around the lobby.
Copy !req
983. This is a moment you will remember
Copy !req
984. for the rest of your life.
Copy !req
985. He's doing it again.
Copy !req
986. And that was the moment
that I really realized
Copy !req
987. I found a group of people
that I not only related to,
Copy !req
988. but they made me feel good about myself.
Copy !req
989. My personality had a place in the world.
Copy !req
990. And the person that told
me that was Uncle Kage.
Copy !req
991. I got us a great hotel, it's perfect.
Copy !req
992. We can be there forever
Copy !req
993. because it's got more space
than we could ever possibly use.
Copy !req
994. First year, bam, full.
Copy !req
995. The next year we filled it
and two hotels down the road,
Copy !req
996. We're going to need bigger space.
Copy !req
997. I looked around in Philadelphia,
got the problem solved.
Copy !req
998. The Adam's Mark has gotten more space
Copy !req
999. than we could ever possibly need.
Copy !req
1000. Bam, full that very first year.
Copy !req
1001. I,457 furries are in the room.
Copy !req
1002. That was 1,457 in case
you didn't hear that.
Copy !req
1003. How many of us are there?
Copy !req
1004. When I was negotiating with Pittsburgh,
Copy !req
1005. I said, okay guys, it's perfect.
Copy !req
1006. We got more space there,
Copy !req
1007. and they said, shhhh, stop, don't say it.
Copy !req
1008. I'm still not allowed to say that phrase
Copy !req
1009. in regards to this city.
Copy !req
1010. It just got more space
than we ever possibly need.
Copy !req
1011. Every convention has a hook.
Copy !req
1012. The hook for Anthrocon
is Pittsburgh itself.
Copy !req
1013. It's the city.
Copy !req
1014. The downtown area is vibrant and alive,
Copy !req
1015. and people are coming down
to watch the fursuit parade.
Copy !req
1016. We were recently told that Anthrocon
Copy !req
1017. is the third most valuable convention
Copy !req
1018. to the city of Pittsburgh itself.
Copy !req
1019. We have become a Pittsburgh institution.
Copy !req
1020. We're not just an event that happens.
Copy !req
1021. We are now part of the city's art scene.
Copy !req
1022. I don't think any other
convention anywhere
Copy !req
1023. has that sort of distinction.
Copy !req
1024. I hate going on stage.
Copy !req
1025. I get stage-fright hardcore.
Copy !req
1026. And people are like, you're the con chair.
Copy !req
1027. You have to be extroverted.
Copy !req
1028. You have to be willing to talk to anybody
Copy !req
1029. and talk about anything.
Copy !req
1030. And I'm not.
Copy !req
1031. The suit definitely helps with that.
Copy !req
1032. I love being in a costume
and being able to act
Copy !req
1033. like something else,
'cause in high school,
Copy !req
1034. I was the school mascot.
Copy !req
1035. I'm more open and comfortable with myself.
Copy !req
1036. Since I was like three years old,
Copy !req
1037. I was trying to take a feather duster
Copy !req
1038. and put it in my shorts.
Copy !req
1039. And then I have a tail.
Copy !req
1040. If you found a mask with feathers on it,
Copy !req
1041. possibilities were endless.
Copy !req
1042. So I was just trying to
make the perfect costume.
Copy !req
1043. And I found furries where
Copy !req
1044. we're all trying to get
the perfect costume.
Copy !req
1045. I had just gotten out of high school
Copy !req
1046. and I was starting to go to college,
Copy !req
1047. and I'm making a fursuit for some reason,
Copy !req
1048. I called a friend up and I was like,
Copy !req
1049. take me to PetSmart.
Copy !req
1050. I need to buy a collar in my costume.
Copy !req
1051. As we're driving back
home, there's this carwash.
Copy !req
1052. And we just see this guy hopping around,
Copy !req
1053. struggling to get people
to come to the carwash.
Copy !req
1054. And I was like, he needs my help.
Copy !req
1055. I jumped in, I was doing jumping jacks
Copy !req
1056. and just helping to get a
bunch of people to pull over.
Copy !req
1057. And it was a success.
Copy !req
1058. People were like, where did you get that?
Copy !req
1059. And then when they'd find out I made it,
Copy !req
1060. they were like, can you make me one?
Copy !req
1061. And I was like, oh, well, I don't know.
Copy !req
1062. I was obsessed with "The Lion King,"
Copy !req
1063. obsessed with pretty
much any animal movie.
Copy !req
1064. So I built my first suit at 17
Copy !req
1065. and I wore it for Halloween
at my high school.
Copy !req
1066. I went to college, got my degree
Copy !req
1067. in something completely unrelated
Copy !req
1068. and was just doing it on the side.
Copy !req
1069. And then it just kind of
accidentally became a business.
Copy !req
1070. And now I'm doing this full time.
Copy !req
1071. I would see the suits
being built and I'm like,
Copy !req
1072. I want to do that.
Copy !req
1073. I could get involved.
Copy !req
1074. And I didn't really feel
very much technology
Copy !req
1075. was really being used in
building these things.
Copy !req
1076. It was a challenge for me.
Copy !req
1077. I wanted to figure out
how to do it my way.
Copy !req
1078. My whole life, I struggled
with anxiety and depression,
Copy !req
1079. and a few years ago I was
diagnosed with bipolar as well.
Copy !req
1080. It's really hard and
it just tears you down,
Copy !req
1081. and I would come home
from work everyday crying.
Copy !req
1082. Nowadays, I feel like
I've done something good.
Copy !req
1083. I'm creating something
for someone to enjoy.
Copy !req
1084. I'm much more stable mentally,
and it feels really good.
Copy !req
1085. I had worked really
hard to have a nice house,
Copy !req
1086. a nice car, typical American dream,
Copy !req
1087. but I found it was really empty.
Copy !req
1088. And I found that it
was, this is, you know,
Copy !req
1089. it was not fulfilling
at the end of the day.
Copy !req
1090. And I've been having
more fun in doing this
Copy !req
1091. than I think I've ever had with
anything in my entire life.
Copy !req
1092. I teamed up with Scuff,
Copy !req
1093. 'cause Scuff was starting to build
Copy !req
1094. pieces and parts on his own.
Copy !req
1095. Not only do you want
a fursuit to look good,
Copy !req
1096. it needs to feel good.
Copy !req
1097. Every fur suit we build is custom,
Copy !req
1098. but that's your fursuit.
Copy !req
1099. It should feel like your
fursuit when you put it on.
Copy !req
1100. I think we've made over 600 fursuits.
Copy !req
1101. I've kind of lost track.
Copy !req
1102. If you can see the camera,
Copy !req
1103. you're in the picture.
Copy !req
1104. All right, let's see those paws up.
Copy !req
1105. It's not just about
the animal characters.
Copy !req
1106. It's about the people and
it's about the, you know,
Copy !req
1107. the atmosphere of it.
Copy !req
1108. You've got writers, artists, animators,
Copy !req
1109. performers, musicians that all collide
Copy !req
1110. into this one massive group.
Copy !req
1111. And that's what makes it interesting.
Copy !req
1112. There's always something new.
Copy !req
1113. My daughter was in the fursuit parade.
Copy !req
1114. People complimented her on her suit,
Copy !req
1115. thought she was adorable.
Copy !req
1116. You want your child to have
as many of those moments
Copy !req
1117. as they can, 'cause in the adult world,
Copy !req
1118. you know, you can't
guarantee that for them.
Copy !req
1119. The talent, he's a, whoa.
Copy !req
1120. We don't know nearly enough about furries.
Copy !req
1121. We're trying to learn.
Copy !req
1122. Excellent.
Copy !req
1123. Get in touch with Mark Merlino.
Copy !req
1124. He's the
man, he the man, yeah.
Copy !req
1125. The earliest media
coverage that I can remember
Copy !req
1126. was in 1993.
Copy !req
1127. The crew from Sci-Fi
channel called Sci-Fi Buzz
Copy !req
1128. wound up going to one of
the early ConFurences.
Copy !req
1129. And they did a very positive piece.
Copy !req
1130. We weren't as careful as
people are these days,
Copy !req
1131. so if people got it wrong,
Copy !req
1132. I quite often would just let it slide.
Copy !req
1133. I sometimes regret that.
Copy !req
1134. This is 2001.
Copy !req
1135. If you look through it,
Copy !req
1136. you'll see a lot of photos of furries
Copy !req
1137. enjoying themselves in fur meets,
Copy !req
1138. and people are talking about
their own take on furry.
Copy !req
1139. Interspersed with other articles
Copy !req
1140. talking about poly groups and
orgies and stuff like that.
Copy !req
1141. That's not what furry
fandom was all about.
Copy !req
1142. I was approached in 99 by a guy
Copy !req
1143. claiming to be a film student.
Copy !req
1144. I thought, you know, I'd help
him with this film project.
Copy !req
1145. So I just answered a few questions
Copy !req
1146. and ended up at on MTV in
a rather unsavory show.
Copy !req
1147. What was even worse was
the CSI episode in 2003.
Copy !req
1148. They actually had locals
on the show as consultants
Copy !req
1149. who say that the show decided to
Copy !req
1150. ignore everything they said,
Copy !req
1151. Unfortunately, that was
the image that was now given.
Copy !req
1152. This is what the world was seeing.
Copy !req
1153. A boss would see at a clip
somewhere on the news.
Copy !req
1154. Oh, you're one of those
weird freaky people
Copy !req
1155. I heard about.
Copy !req
1156. Some folk lost jobs, lost relationships.
Copy !req
1157. I had people at Disney
telling me that I had to leave
Copy !req
1158. in order to focus on
my career or you know,
Copy !req
1159. or else I wouldn't have
a career in animation.
Copy !req
1160. And so I had to make a
decision and that decision
Copy !req
1161. was to leave the fandom
to focus on a career.
Copy !req
1162. You don't tell your family,
you don't tell your work,
Copy !req
1163. you don't tell other people.
Copy !req
1164. That definitely made
for a insular environment,
Copy !req
1165. especially in the early 2000s.
Copy !req
1166. And you, you need to sell
your magazine or something.
Copy !req
1167. You want people to pick
that thing up and read it.
Copy !req
1168. Well, you can talk to
this person for 45 minutes
Copy !req
1169. about, oh, I made this fursuit
and it took me this long,
Copy !req
1170. and here's how I stitched
it, and this is the.
Copy !req
1171. You can talk to this guy over here.
Copy !req
1172. Well, yeah, I'm a writer, I write stories.
Copy !req
1173. And then my stories are all about furries,
Copy !req
1174. and I put furries in
the stories and I write.
Copy !req
1175. Or you get the guy who says yeah,
Copy !req
1176. I like to have sex in my fursuit.
Copy !req
1177. That's what's gonna sell.
Copy !req
1178. Damned if I'm going to stand around
Copy !req
1179. and let you put this TV show on
Copy !req
1180. that's going to make them embarrassed
Copy !req
1181. to be a part of this remarkable thing
Copy !req
1182. that we have created together.
Copy !req
1183. So I fought back.
Copy !req
1184. Here is the problem we face.
Copy !req
1185. The media wants to do
stories on furry fandom.
Copy !req
1186. Very, very often, they are
going to be asking questions.
Copy !req
1187. Does that sort of thing
go on at your convention?
Copy !req
1188. Look, I run the thing.
Copy !req
1189. If that sort of thing was
going on in my convention,
Copy !req
1190. number one, I would like
to think I know about it.
Copy !req
1191. Number two, why am I not invited?
Copy !req
1192. Yeah, you're all laughing.
Copy !req
1193. Ha ha, it's a joke.
Copy !req
1194. You notice I didn't say no?
Copy !req
1195. Never lie.
Copy !req
1196. But you can minimize it.
Copy !req
1197. Anthrocon is not just
for people in costume.
Copy !req
1198. It's for artists, cartoonists, performers,
Copy !req
1199. and we have writers, artists, puppeteers,
Copy !req
1200. and there'll be wandering about.
Copy !req
1201. If you see a large raccoon
on the streets of Pittsburgh,
Copy !req
1202. Don't be alarmed, it's just us.
Copy !req
1203. If they're gonna have
their misconceptions,
Copy !req
1204. the only thing we can do is
stand back and say, here we are.
Copy !req
1205. Kage is
always is out there talking
Copy !req
1206. about the money we bring to the city
Copy !req
1207. and the good will we bring to the city.
Copy !req
1208. He knew how to make furry
Copy !req
1209. appealing to the public at large.
Copy !req
1210. And it is just so gratifying and rewarding
Copy !req
1211. to come to a place where
you're welcome and embraced.
Copy !req
1212. Yes. Welcome to opening ceremonies
Copy !req
1213. of what looks to continue to be
Copy !req
1214. the largest and furriest
convention in the world.
Copy !req
1215. Everybody's scared of saying it.
Copy !req
1216. It's fine, sex is fine.
Copy !req
1217. And sometimes we have it.
Copy !req
1218. It's not what defines the community,
Copy !req
1219. but it's part of the community.
Copy !req
1220. And for a lot of people,
Copy !req
1221. this community helped them
discover what that means.
Copy !req
1222. How could you just try
to say it doesn't exist?
Copy !req
1223. That's insane.
Copy !req
1224. I've been accused of
whitewashing the fandom.
Copy !req
1225. I've been accused of, oh, he's
trying to control the media.
Copy !req
1226. Well, you know what?
Copy !req
1227. You try it someday.
Copy !req
1228. You know, let's get you
in front of a camera
Copy !req
1229. and have them say, okay,
Copy !req
1230. so what's it like to
have sex in a fursuit?
Copy !req
1231. Let's have you answer that question.
Copy !req
1232. Especially if you know that
your grandmom's watching.
Copy !req
1233. Or your mom or your dad
or your future spouse.
Copy !req
1234. When furry fandom first began,
Copy !req
1235. it was organized by some fellows who,
Copy !req
1236. as enthusiastic as they were,
Copy !req
1237. really did not pay much mind
to the sort of public image
Copy !req
1238. they were giving to
this burgeoning fandom.
Copy !req
1239. Let's face it.
Copy !req
1240. I was there.
Copy !req
1241. Kind of looked like pride
fest on an acid trip.
Copy !req
1242. I have worked very, very,
Copy !req
1243. very hard to foster good
relationships with the local media
Copy !req
1244. and with the city of Pittsburgh.
Copy !req
1245. I want to keep it that way.
Copy !req
1246. I've heard at
least one opinion up there
Copy !req
1247. that the physical aspect
seems more prevalent,
Copy !req
1248. the sexual aspect.
Copy !req
1249. Why do you think, where do
you think it originated from?
Copy !req
1250. If you're going to put all your effort
Copy !req
1251. into one little piece, you
want to make sure it sells,
Copy !req
1252. and the one that's sure to
sell is that hot steamy one.
Copy !req
1253. On the internet, it's horrible,
Copy !req
1254. 'cause like you cannot find
any good, normal furry art.
Copy !req
1255. You go into the ConFurence art show,
Copy !req
1256. and even in the general audience section,
Copy !req
1257. there's stuff that I
wouldn't show a child.
Copy !req
1258. Or my mother or any of my friends
Copy !req
1259. outside furry fandom.
Copy !req
1260. I mean, sex sells everywhere.
Copy !req
1261. You look in any subculture,
mainstream subculture,
Copy !req
1262. goth, furry, anywhere.
Copy !req
1263. Not to the extreme extent
Copy !req
1264. that it is portrayed
and pushed and produced
Copy !req
1265. in furry fandom.
Copy !req
1266. Next, please.
Copy !req
1267. We started getting problems with people
Copy !req
1268. trying to sabotage the
convention pretty early on.
Copy !req
1269. You had to chalk this up to the fact
Copy !req
1270. that people didn't like Rodney and I,
Copy !req
1271. especially because we were a couple.
Copy !req
1272. They naturally assumed our main interest
Copy !req
1273. was have gathering of
like-minded people for sex.
Copy !req
1274. And a lot of these rumors
were strung on for years.
Copy !req
1275. And then a Bay Area, furry convention
Copy !req
1276. was gonna to happen in January.
Copy !req
1277. This same time ours had
happened for nearly 10 years.
Copy !req
1278. So we decided to change our dates.
Copy !req
1279. A lot of the fans from San Diego said,
Copy !req
1280. how about the Town and Country?
Copy !req
1281. We've been having science
fiction conventions
Copy !req
1282. there for years.
Copy !req
1283. So I went and talked to the hotel
Copy !req
1284. and I cut a deal with them.
Copy !req
1285. But we tried have our planning
meetings in San Diego.
Copy !req
1286. The staff from up here would not come.
Copy !req
1287. They wouldn't drive it.
Copy !req
1288. And more and more of the responsibility
Copy !req
1289. fell on me and Rodney.
Copy !req
1290. And it was taking all my time.
Copy !req
1291. ... by all the flood water.
Copy !req
1292. As the nail in the coffin,
Copy !req
1293. we had the worst April weather
Copy !req
1294. they've ever had in San Diego in 20 years.
Copy !req
1295. It was actually hailing in San Diego.
Copy !req
1296. Attendance was down by
at least 200 people.
Copy !req
1297. When I had the staff meeting
at the end of the convention,
Copy !req
1298. I said, okay, I have worked with Rodney,
Copy !req
1299. ran this convention from zero to 10.
Copy !req
1300. I am stepping down.
Copy !req
1301. People looked around for
someone to replace me
Copy !req
1302. and the gentleman who had been
doing our daily newsletter,
Copy !req
1303. stood up and said, I will take it over.
Copy !req
1304. And everyone said great.
Copy !req
1305. I guess it was in 2003.
Copy !req
1306. He basically stood up at the
closing ceremonies and said,
Copy !req
1307. I am officially closing
ConFurence forever.
Copy !req
1308. He had told us that he
had trademarked the name
Copy !req
1309. and that nobody else could ever have
Copy !req
1310. a convention called ConFurence.
Copy !req
1311. I feel strange saying this,
Copy !req
1312. but I expected it to get bigger.
Copy !req
1313. I just had this dream in my head
Copy !req
1314. of everything kind of coming together,
Copy !req
1315. but we're going into an era
Copy !req
1316. where people are more about
breaking apart communities
Copy !req
1317. rather than coming together
into big communities.
Copy !req
1318. And unfortunately, there's furry, too.
Copy !req
1319. Conventions were kind of viewed
Copy !req
1320. by their host hotels and their host cities
Copy !req
1321. as, what is this stuff?
Copy !req
1322. Some folk got together.
Copy !req
1323. They called themselves the Burned Furs
Copy !req
1324. having been burned by this
image that was being projected.
Copy !req
1325. The Burned Furs were out
to clean up the fandom,
Copy !req
1326. get rid of all of that sex related stuff.
Copy !req
1327. Now, I kind of agreed in
principle with that concept.
Copy !req
1328. We okay, we can have fun,
Copy !req
1329. but can we do it over there,
where people aren't looking?
Copy !req
1330. And I thought, hey, this
seems like a good idea.
Copy !req
1331. Clean up fandom, why not?
Copy !req
1332. But it was to the extreme.
Copy !req
1333. I've seen this fandom to
generate from a very nice thing
Copy !req
1334. into a endless parade of human debris.
Copy !req
1335. Thank you very much.
Copy !req
1336. This is Limbaugh.
Copy !req
1337. The Burned Furs felt
that there were people
Copy !req
1338. in fur fandom that they did not like
Copy !req
1339. who should be somehow
pushed out of the fandom.
Copy !req
1340. Particularly people
who like Rodney and I,
Copy !req
1341. who were gay or bi and
demonstratively so at conventions.
Copy !req
1342. Hanging out with their boyfriend,
Copy !req
1343. cuddling on the couch or something.
Copy !req
1344. What if, what if a
underage person sees that?
Copy !req
1345. So this group wanted
to do something about it
Copy !req
1346. and they had a manifesto
of cleaning up the fandom.
Copy !req
1347. No one was complaining
Copy !req
1348. when all of the art was female pinups
Copy !req
1349. and heterosexual couples.
Copy !req
1350. It was okay.
Copy !req
1351. And ultimately the pushback
against porn and adult content
Copy !req
1352. in furry is an attempt to
push LGBT furs out of furry.
Copy !req
1353. Somehow Mark and I were at fault
Copy !req
1354. for the appearance of LGBT
people in among furry fandom,
Copy !req
1355. which if we wanted to, we
wouldn't have known how.
Copy !req
1356. Furry fandom has attracted every stripe
Copy !req
1357. of the political spectrum.
Copy !req
1358. Although we could all sit
around and discuss Donald Duck,
Copy !req
1359. if we got into talking
about whether or not
Copy !req
1360. there should be gay marriage allowed,
Copy !req
1361. there would be bottles being thrown.
Copy !req
1362. It's interesting how this
entire thing got sidetracked,
Copy !req
1363. essentially got completely sidetracked.
Copy !req
1364. The current alt-right problem
Copy !req
1365. in furry fandom is the
current alt-right problem
Copy !req
1366. in the United States,
Copy !req
1367. which is the current alt-right problem.
Copy !req
1368. In Western civilization,
Copy !req
1369. You are seeing more politics
Copy !req
1370. than you've ever seen before get in.
Copy !req
1371. I think once you've got the
Trump administration in,
Copy !req
1372. you saw a lot of furries become
Copy !req
1373. much more politically active,
Copy !req
1374. and that's made it more difficult
for convention organizers
Copy !req
1375. to know what they should
and shouldn't respond to.
Copy !req
1376. We have a pocket of individuals here,
Copy !req
1377. intertwining with the
larger online community
Copy !req
1378. of the alt-right.
Copy !req
1379. Entangled with people that represent
Copy !req
1380. a hate message towards
marginalized individuals.
Copy !req
1381. Different conventions have
had politics take them down.
Copy !req
1382. For the furry community,
that's pretty bad
Copy !req
1383. 'cause a lot of us are LGBTIA.
Copy !req
1384. I don't think that I would have been
Copy !req
1385. the person that I am today
Copy !req
1386. if I didn't have furry cons.
Copy !req
1387. No doubt.
Copy !req
1388. Thank you for this year.
Copy !req
1389. Thank you for everything up to this year.
Copy !req
1390. And we'll see you tomorrow.
Copy !req
1391. We'll see you next year and good evening.
Copy !req
1392. Hi mom.
Copy !req
1393. Well, early on I had encountered people
Copy !req
1394. who said I came to the convention
Copy !req
1395. and I walked into the
lobby and I felt I'm home.
Copy !req
1396. I'm finally home.
Copy !req
1397. They found their family,
they found their people,
Copy !req
1398. they found their culture, and
that aspect has not changed.
Copy !req
1399. Once I'm committed to something,
Copy !req
1400. I don't want to let it go.
Copy !req
1401. I can't let it go until the dies.
Copy !req
1402. We've all grown as a community together,
Copy !req
1403. but we want to make sure that
Copy !req
1404. what we're doing now is what
the community wants now.
Copy !req
1405. And I know if we lose these conventions,
Copy !req
1406. we'll lose a lot of our community.
Copy !req
1407. We have younger people
coming into the fandom
Copy !req
1408. and they see how open everybody
is and they deserve that.
Copy !req
1409. They deserve the
opportunities that we have
Copy !req
1410. or that we didn't have
when we were younger.
Copy !req
1411. We can create environments
where people are safe,
Copy !req
1412. where we don't overreact,
where we're not dramatic
Copy !req
1413. and just try to be in the best interest
Copy !req
1414. of our attendees overall,
and let them have
Copy !req
1415. the environment they
can to be they wanna be.
Copy !req
1416. A lot of the negativity
Copy !req
1417. comes from these big voices online.
Copy !req
1418. And when you take it into perspective,
Copy !req
1419. there's a thousand other people
Copy !req
1420. that are having a good time.
Copy !req
1421. I couldn't let it go.
Copy !req
1422. I would, I would feel so guilty.
Copy !req
1423. I think this year went really well.
Copy !req
1424. 2,700 attendees.
Copy !req
1425. We raised $15,000 for charity.
Copy !req
1426. For Denver, we have
Freedom Service Dogs,
Copy !req
1427. where last year we raised $15,000.
Copy !req
1428. So they can have an awning for the dogs
Copy !req
1429. when they go outside so it didn't burn
Copy !req
1430. their paw pads.
Copy !req
1431. When they're going from the
indoor training facilities
Copy !req
1432. to the outdoor kennels,
Copy !req
1433. We raise
as much money as we can
Copy !req
1434. for the charity we choose.
Copy !req
1435. We try to pick them locally
Copy !req
1436. and they're usually animal related.
Copy !req
1437. I really feel like I
owe a lot to the community
Copy !req
1438. just because it's taught me so much.
Copy !req
1439. It's made me become much more
Copy !req
1440. of a open and understanding person.
Copy !req
1441. And we are, I think,
outgrowing those stereotypes.
Copy !req
1442. I think we're becoming
appreciated for ourselves.
Copy !req
1443. Artists are really like the backbone
Copy !req
1444. of so much of what happens
Copy !req
1445. because that's how we're representing
Copy !req
1446. these characters at all.
Copy !req
1447. I remember at the first few conventions,
Copy !req
1448. no, nobody's ever gonna make
a living off of doing this.
Copy !req
1449. You're crazy to think
that, and here we are today
Copy !req
1450. and there's probably hundreds of artists
Copy !req
1451. making some or all of
their living off of this.
Copy !req
1452. I think the fandom
has made my life better.
Copy !req
1453. I probably wouldn't even have
Copy !req
1454. a quarter of the life that I do now.
Copy !req
1455. I'd have a different career.
Copy !req
1456. I don't know if I'd be happy.
Copy !req
1457. I'd be just a nobody in a crowd.
Copy !req
1458. I would never have met my husband.
Copy !req
1459. I would never have met my best friends.
Copy !req
1460. Every single one of my
closest friends is a furry.
Copy !req
1461. Just thinking about not
having that experience is hard.
Copy !req
1462. Not having that, I don't know what I do.
Copy !req
1463. I don't really want to think about
Copy !req
1464. because it seems like it would be
Copy !req
1465. a very, very dark road to go down.
Copy !req
1466. We have our typical
story we have about fandom.
Copy !req
1467. What is furry fandom?
Copy !req
1468. On, it's a bunch of guys who
like sitting around drawing.
Copy !req
1469. And a lot of the films
were really popular.
Copy !req
1470. That was the first convention.
Copy !req
1471. Our fandom is based on a concept,
Copy !req
1472. and that concept isn't going away.
Copy !req
1473. I go around to conventions
Copy !req
1474. and I look at the fur suit parade.
Copy !req
1475. I look at the dances.
Copy !req
1476. I look at the dealers' rooms
and how big they've gotten
Copy !req
1477. and I'll admit it.
Copy !req
1478. I sometimes will walk
around kind of going.
Copy !req
1479. Yeah, yeah.
Copy !req
1480. I was involved with starting this, yeah.
Copy !req
1481. We're still in it.
Copy !req
1482. And we're probably not
going to get out of it.
Copy !req
1483. I don't intend to ever get out of it.
Copy !req
1484. I think the fandom is something
Copy !req
1485. I'm the most proud of in my life.
Copy !req
1486. When people are having
fun at a convention,
Copy !req
1487. at a meetup, online, or just two people
Copy !req
1488. who never would have met one another
Copy !req
1489. who discover a mutual love of furry
Copy !req
1490. and they get married.
Copy !req
1491. Yeah, that's what we're about.
Copy !req