1. Thanks.Copy !req
2. Thank you.Copy !req
3. I can remember riding around on the back
of my mother's bicycle in her little seat...Copy !req
4. the basket seat on the back...Copy !req
5. because we were celebrating
the end of World War II...Copy !req
6. because we, the Americans...Copy !req
7. had dropped the bombs
on the Japs in Hiroshima...Copy !req
8. and we were celebrating because
my mother's brothers, Tinky and John...Copy !req
9. were coming home from the war.Copy !req
10. Maybe I should just tell you
some of the facts as I remember them.Copy !req
11. I grew up in Barrington, Rhode Island...Copy !req
12. in a clapboard house.Copy !req
13. At the time I was a child...Copy !req
14. I guess I was told
that it was 75 years old.Copy !req
15. It had a well —
a bucket well...Copy !req
16. and an artesian well —
two wells.Copy !req
17. A well you could drop
a bucket down into...Copy !req
18. and hoist it up and drink
fresh water in the summer.Copy !req
19. It had a barn,
which we kept garden tools in...Copy !req
20. and cars as well — two cars.Copy !req
21. And an attic upstairs
and a cellar in the barn.Copy !req
22. A lovely garden
that my grandfather and father...Copy !req
23. grew everything in...Copy !req
24. including peanuts, Swiss chard.Copy !req
25. My Grandmother Gray,
my father's mother, lived with us.Copy !req
26. I was the middle of three boys...Copy !req
27. so my parents had three sons.Copy !req
28. And so I got a little kitten, Mittens.Copy !req
29. I called it Mittens 'cause it had
those little white, you know, paws.Copy !req
30. And so this Mittens...Copy !req
31. I hadn't had it very long
before it was killed by Mrs. Adams...Copy !req
32. driving a large
black Chrysler at dusk...Copy !req
33. on Rumstick Road.Copy !req
34. Mrs. Adams was a very big woman.
She had two daughters...Copy !req
35. that my brothers and I called
"piggy big sisters."Copy !req
36. They were very big,
and they looked like pigs.
That's the most I can remember of them.Copy !req
37. And Mrs. Adams was mortified.
She realized what she'd done.Copy !req
38. She stopped the car
and she chased me, and I ran.Copy !req
39. I couldn't face her.
I couldn't breathe. I was so —Copy !req
40. I couldn't catch my breath,
and I ran to my room, and she chased me.Copy !req
41. I think she made it
as far as the front door...Copy !req
42. and my mother, I suppose, stopped her
and talked with her, but she never got to me.Copy !req
43. I went and locked myself in my room.
I was catatonic. Couldn't catch my breath.Copy !req
44. Something like my brother actually couldn't —
He'd go through that too —Copy !req
45. extreme anxieties — my older brother.Copy !req
46. We were sleeping in the same bedroom,
and I'd wake up in the middle of the night...Copy !req
47. and he'd be holding his throat,
blue in the face...Copy !req
48. telling my mother and father he was dying
because he couldn't breathe, you see?Copy !req
49. And they'd be sitting at the edge
of the bed, trying to calm him down.Copy !req
50. He was standing on the bed.
Finally, they would calm him down...Copy !req
51. and my father would go to bed,
and my mother would stay with him...Copy !req
52. and she'd turn out the lights
and sit on the edge of his bed...Copy !req
53. and we would look up at the ceiling,
which the only light...Copy !req
54. was these fluorescent decals
of the stars —Copy !req
55. the Big Dipper, a new moon, Saturn.Copy !req
56. And my brother would start in.
He'd say...Copy !req
57. "Mom, when I die, is it forever?"Copy !req
58. She'd go, "Yes, dear."Copy !req
59. He'd go, "Mom, when I die...Copy !req
60. is it forever and ever?"Copy !req
61. She'd go, "Mm-hmm, dear."Copy !req
62. Then he'd go, "Mom...Copy !req
63. when I die,
is it forever and ever...Copy !req
64. and ever and ever?"Copy !req
65. She'd go, "Mm."Copy !req
66. And I'd just fall asleep to this.Copy !req
67. It would put me right out,
and he would always get upset with me...Copy !req
68. for being the calm one, you see?Copy !req
69. Well, there were two extreme
nervous breakdowns...Copy !req
70. and probably a lot of nervous
"in between" that she had...Copy !req
71. and the first one was
when I was I think ten years old.Copy !req
72. And it was in the summer...Copy !req
73. and, uh, it was —Copy !req
74. She was just very nervous
and pulling at her hair...Copy !req
75. and unable to concentrate
and talking to herself.Copy !req
76. And so she was —Copy !req
77. Then I think at that time, she was sent away
to a Christian Science nursing home.Copy !req
78. I tell you, the most difficult thing
about it for me was that...Copy !req
79. the denial that was going on
around the house.Copy !req
80. My Grandmother Gray lived with us
at the time — my father's mother —Copy !req
81. and no one was ever coming...Copy !req
82. to me or my brothers...Copy !req
83. and saying... talking about it.Copy !req
84. So that I'd be in the playroom
with my friends in the summer...Copy !req
85. and all of a sudden I'd hear Mom...Copy !req
86. shrieking in the — in the kitchen...Copy !req
87. crying out to Jesus and going...Copy !req
88. "Oh, Rock! Oh, no! Oh!"
you know...Copy !req
89. just in distress,
like she's being attacked.Copy !req
90. I can remember pausing,
and my friends would be afraid.Copy !req
91. We'd all be afraid and be looking
at each other, and no one would say...Copy !req
92. "Was that your mother?"
or "What was that?"Copy !req
93. It was like a ghost.Copy !req
94. I think that some people
are born people...Copy !req
95. and they grow up as people and then
they decide to become professionals...Copy !req
96. 'cause they have
to make a living, right?Copy !req
97. And they become a dentist, doctor
or lawyer, whatever it is they study for...Copy !req
98. and then they go through life as that,
and then they die, and that's that.Copy !req
99. You know, even some people study acting.
They become actors through studying acting.Copy !req
100. Other people are born actors.Copy !req
101. It's an ontological condition.
There's no way out.Copy !req
102. They are simply acting out all the time,
you know? And I think I was in that state.Copy !req
103. For instance, I was 12 years old...Copy !req
104. and some fireworks would go off,
just a whole package of lady fingers outside.Copy !req
105. And I'd take the cue
and rush to the window...Copy !req
106. and go, "Mom! Mom, come quick!Copy !req
107. Russ Russell, our neighbor,
is up on his roof shooting his children!"Copy !req
108. And that was before that happened
so often, you know?Copy !req
109. In the old days.
It wasn't a common occurrence.Copy !req
110. And my mother would buy right into it.
She'd rush over going, "What?Copy !req
111. Oh! Oh! Oh —
No, no.Copy !req
112. Oh, Spuddy dear, no."Copy !req
113. She would be...Copy !req
114. well, very, very forthcoming,
and helping me with my spelling words...Copy !req
115. and taking me on my paper route...Copy !req
116. and telling me intimate stories...Copy !req
117. about her relationship to my father
that I probably shouldn't have heard.Copy !req
118. And then all of a sudden one day
when I was 14...Copy !req
119. and had failed seventh grade
and tried to knock myself out.Copy !req
120. We used to take 20 deep breaths
after a hot bath...Copy !req
121. and blow on your thumb.Copy !req
122. What was I doing?
I don't know. Some crazy thing.Copy !req
123. And I got knocked out,
and when I came to, my arm...Copy !req
124. this arm, was against the radiator...Copy !req
125. and I had a third-degree burn —
it looked like rare roast beef—Copy !req
126. and it was a miracle
I was still alive...Copy !req
127. that I didn't break a blood vessel
in my head or just, you know.Copy !req
128. And my parents were downstairs
watching television —Copy !req
129. Gunsmoke, I remember —
in the playroom.Copy !req
130. And I walked down, shaking all over
with this incredible burn...Copy !req
131. and my mother
looked at it and went...Copy !req
132. "Oh, put some soap on it, dear,
and know the truth" —Copy !req
133. the truth being that there is no...Copy !req
134. pain or suffering in God's world,
there's no imperfection.Copy !req
135. That is enormous distance, you see?Copy !req
136. That's what I mean
by "alternating current."Copy !req
137. Any mother,
I don't care what religion she's in...Copy !req
138. would, I would think —
Intuition would be to fly to that child.Copy !req
139. But for her, it would represent
acknowledging the condition.Copy !req
140. She really believed in the power of mind.
Our pipes used to freeze in a bathroom...Copy !req
141. from the wind off Narragansett Bay,
which is very ice-cold in February...Copy !req
142. and she was sure that the wind
was caused by the disturbed thinking...Copy !req
143. of the Red Chinese
in Communist China.Copy !req
144. You see?Copy !req
145. And she told me that Mary Baker Eddy
said there was a man who was so afraid...Copy !req
146. when he was on the operating table,
he was sweating, he thought it was blood...Copy !req
147. and he died of fear, you see?Copy !req
148. So we were always afraid of being afraid.
It was never-ending.Copy !req
149. My father, he said,
"Why don't we go play golf together?"Copy !req
150. Now, we had never played golf together.Copy !req
151. We never even joined the country club.Copy !req
152. My uncle said there were two kinds of people
in Barrington, Rhode Island —Copy !req
153. those who belong and those who don't —
to the Rhode Island Country Club.Copy !req
154. We didn't belong.Copy !req
155. Later, my Grandmother Gray
told me that my father's father...Copy !req
156. told him the facts of life
on a golf course...Copy !req
157. so this is where my father
got the idea from.Copy !req
158. So we went out —
We had to go to a public course...Copy !req
159. in Seekonk, Massachusetts,
called Wampanoag.Copy !req
160. Now, mainly when it rained,
it was underwater...Copy !req
161. so we called it Swampanoag.Copy !req
162. So we get out there.
I think we were on the fourth hole...Copy !req
163. and my father went...Copy !req
164. "You know" —
This just came out of nowhere.Copy !req
165. He said, "There's a gal in our plant."Copy !req
166. He worked in a factory. He called it a plant.
It was a very conservative factory...Copy !req
167. where they made screw machines,
machines that made screws...Copy !req
168. and they didn't even allow Coca-Cola
in this plant until a few years ago.Copy !req
169. And he said,
"There's a gal in our plant...Copy !req
170. who has a turkey in the oven...Copy !req
171. and she won't admit to it."Copy !req
172. "It's, uh — It's as plain
as the nose on her face.Copy !req
173. She won't admit to it because
she doesn't have a man. She's not married...Copy !req
174. and she keeps coming to work
because she has no one to support her.Copy !req
175. People are saying,
'Why don't you go have the turkey...Copy !req
176. and come back when you're through?'
But she —"Copy !req
177. "Now, you wouldn't want
to get a gal...Copy !req
178. in a situation like that, would you?"Copy !req
179. And I said,
"Well, I guess not. No. No."Copy !req
180. And then there was a pause.
We were kind of going with our clubs...Copy !req
181. and walking and putting,
and he said...Copy !req
182. "Um, you know, there are diseases
that can make you blind."Copy !req
183. Now, I didn't know what he was
talking about then. I didn't know.Copy !req
184. I was a little paranoid then,
and I thought...Copy !req
185. "Oh, Jeannie Lamb's mother
has found out.Copy !req
186. She's told Dad to take me
out on the golf course and say...Copy !req
187. 'Tell your son that if he fucks
my daughter, he'll go blind.'"Copy !req
188. - We played golf out on the —
- We did. That's right.Copy !req
189. Wampanoag Trail, the public course.Copy !req
190. And in fact, that's where you first
attempted to tell me the facts of life.Copy !req
191. - Was it?
- Yeah.Copy !req
192. - We were out to the fourth hole.
- On the fourth hole?Copy !req
193. And you told me about a woman
that got pregnant at Brown & Sharpe —Copy !req
194. - On the fourth hole?
- Yeah.Copy !req
195. I don't think you said she had a turkey in
the oven, but you might have. I don't know.Copy !req
196. Would that be something you'd say?
Or did I make that up?Copy !req
197. Sometimes I don't know
when I'm fictionalizing or not.Copy !req
198. I sometimes don't know
whether you are either, but —Copy !req
199. My Uncle Tinky
introduced me to wine.Copy !req
200. His name was Ted.
We called him Tinky. I don't know why.Copy !req
201. But he brought wine — two bottles
of Great Western sparkling Burgundy...Copy !req
202. every Thanksgiving and Christmas —
to my grandmother's house.Copy !req
203. Now, I sat next to my Grandmother Gray,
and she didn't like sparkling Burgundy...Copy !req
204. so I got two glasses, which means
I was twice-over happy twice a year.Copy !req
205. I was happy
on Thanksgiving and Christmas.Copy !req
206. The rest of the year was mainly waiting
for the sparkling Burgundy.Copy !req
207. And I told my friend Duke Watts, I said,
"This wine is good.Copy !req
208. Wine is a good thing.
We must find it."Copy !req
209. "To have it more days of the year."Copy !req
210. The way we would do it,
we discovered a plan —Copy !req
211. he had his drivers' license,
I didn't have mine yet —Copy !req
212. was to drive down toward Newport,
the naval base...Copy !req
213. but not go over the Mount Hope Bridge,
because we didn't want to pay the dollar.Copy !req
214. It was owned by Haffenreffer,
and he was charging a dollar to go over
and a dollar to come back.Copy !req
215. We would turn around right at the bridge
and head back and pick up sailors.Copy !req
216. So we would go, and they would say,
"All right, what do you want?"Copy !req
217. And we always wanted to say to them,
"We would like two bottles...Copy !req
218. of Great Western sparkling Burgundy."Copy !req
219. But we were afraid to.
I don't know why.Copy !req
220. We were afraid that the sailors
would think we were —Copy !req
221. So they'd say, "What do you want?"
you know?Copy !req
222. And we'd say, "We want wine."
"Well, what kind?"Copy !req
223. "Red wine," we'd say,
'cause we didn't know the kinds.Copy !req
224. And they'd always come out
with a quart bottle of Petri port.Copy !req
225. Which we started to like.
It was sweeter.Copy !req
226. It was 20 percent alcohol,
although it didn't have the little bubbles.Copy !req
227. And so we were having —Copy !req
228. We liked drinking in the afternoons,
when our energy was at the highest.Copy !req
229. We called these afternoon
drinking sessions "luncheons."Copy !req
230. That was our code word so my parents
wouldn't know what was going on.Copy !req
231. And a typical luncheon
would be a bottle of Petri port...Copy !req
232. and we would listen to Sidney Bechet
full blast on Duke Watts's record player...Copy !req
233. and then jump out his second-story
window after we got drunk, land...Copy !req
234. come around, come back upstairs, drink
some more, jump out the window, land...Copy !req
235. while the music was playing,
just letting off steam.Copy !req
236. I was failing everything, and I got sent away
to school, to Fryeburg Academy...Copy !req
237. and I thought I would try out
for the junior play.Copy !req
238. And not only was I dyslexic, but I was
so nervous I couldn't hold a book.Copy !req
239. I was...Copy !req
240. So I didn't get the role.Copy !req
241. So my senior year, they did
The Curious Savage as the class play...Copy !req
242. and I said, "By God,
I'm gonna try out the way I read...Copy !req
243. and I'm gonna hold the book down
so it won't move"...Copy !req
244. and I just read it
the only way I could read it.Copy !req
245. "Cheese, eggs, milk, meat. Ha, ha.Copy !req
246. I drink about four pints
of milk a day—Copy !req
247. Channel Island milk— ha, ha —Copy !req
248. and eat about a pound of steak."Copy !req
249. And I got the role...Copy !req
250. because it took place
in an insane asylum.Copy !req
251. They thought
I was perfect for the role...Copy !req
252. of the man
who thinks he's Hannibal.Copy !req
253. He's deluded. He has delusions of grandeur,
and he thinks not only is he Hannibal...Copy !req
254. that he can play the violin — And at the end
of the play, everyone's fantasy comes true.Copy !req
255. They put on violin music, and I'm —
sawing away.Copy !req
256. Now, opening night — and of course we only
played two nights at Fryeburg Academy—Copy !req
257. but opening night, there was a carpet
down there, you know, with squares on it.Copy !req
258. It wasn't at rehearsal. And I remember
I had to do a downstage left cross...Copy !req
259. and I improvised a hopscotch,
in character, on the squares.Copy !req
260. And the entire audience laughed.Copy !req
261. Like that.
Only everyone, complete.Copy !req
262. And I was hooked.
I was hooked.Copy !req
263. It went through me like a "thoop!"
Like a "whoo!" Like a you-know-what.Copy !req
264. And I didn't want to do anything else.Copy !req
265. There was nothing else I wanted to do
before that, so this was a novelty.Copy !req
266. I remember that a very important thing
happened in that Curious Savage.Copy !req
267. The stage manager kept trying
to give me my lines...Copy !req
268. because my timing —
they didn't appreciate my timing.Copy !req
269. And Ruth Hartz— I remember
Mrs. Hartz, the director, said...Copy !req
270. "Don't ever give Spud a cue.Copy !req
271. Don't ever give him his line
unless he asks for it...Copy !req
272. because he has excellent timing."Copy !req
273. And that's the first time
anyone had said...Copy !req
274. the word "excellent"
in relationship to anything I did.Copy !req
275. And to say it around timing —
well, that's everything, isn't it?Copy !req
276. I was a virgin when I entered college.Copy !req
277. And I was at a party...Copy !req
278. and my friend Randy
came up to me and said...Copy !req
279. "You see that girl?Copy !req
280. Her name's Pam,
and she goes down."Copy !req
281. "And I'm going to go down with her
before the night's over."Copy !req
282. And I thought I'd try to beat him out,
and I went up and said...Copy !req
283. "Hi, Pam. My name's Spud,
and I hear you go down."Copy !req
284. And we spent the night together.Copy !req
285. I began by licking her breasts.Copy !req
286. She said, "What do you think I am,
your mother?"Copy !req
287. Um...Copy !req
288. then we had intercourse.Copy !req
289. And I came in about 30 seconds...Copy !req
290. and I ended up lying there for the rest
of the night, staring at the ceiling.Copy !req
291. And I have to tell you
I was a little anxious...Copy !req
292. because my bed
was right by the window.Copy !req
293. I kept rearranging the bed, but the room
was so small that no matter where I put it...Copy !req
294. it was basically by the window.Copy !req
295. Why was it upsetting for me? Because
I was reading Freud for the first time...Copy !req
296. and I read that Freud
had discovered an unconscious.Copy !req
297. I don't remember how, but he had.Copy !req
298. And this was a shock for me, because
up until then, I thought I was here.Copy !req
299. I didn't know there was a whole part
of me missing. I didn't know...Copy !req
300. there was this "un"...Copy !req
301. which, if you don't know how big it is,
could go on forever. It could be huge.Copy !req
302. And I thought it was housing all the
self-destructive shadow aspects of myself...Copy !req
303. and that if I went to sleep
by that window...Copy !req
304. the "un" would take over
my body in the night...Copy !req
305. and jump out the window with it.Copy !req
306. And halfway down,
the conscious self, waking up...Copy !req
307. would be desperately
grasping at the bricks.Copy !req
308. Now, this upset me so much
that I transferred
to Emerson College down the road.Copy !req
309. But you know what I was
curious about was that...Copy !req
310. what you thought about when I first starting
going into acting at Emerson College.Copy !req
311. - I thought you were absolutely nuts.
- Yeah.Copy !req
312. How anybody could make
a living in the theater...Copy !req
313. particularly one that was a shy,
backwards sort of young fellow —Copy !req
314. I just knew you couldn't do it.Copy !req
315. Long Day's Journey Into Night.
This was a role I really got into.Copy !req
316. I was playing Edmund,
the O'Neill role.Copy !req
317. I was drinking whiskey, Irish whiskey.Copy !req
318. I was suffering.
I was reading the O'Neill biography.Copy !req
319. I was living in a big Victorian house.
It was Theatre by the Sea,
in Portsmouth, New Hampshire.Copy !req
320. Tugboats out there.
Perfect sound effects.Copy !req
321. Me drinking the whiskey
and refusing to turn up the heat...Copy !req
322. in this very cold Victorian house
with a widow's walk...Copy !req
323. and the owner of the house who's renting me
this room is saying, "Please, please.Copy !req
324. I'll lower the rent
if you turn up the heat."Copy !req
325. And I wouldn't do it. And the pipes
were bursting, and he was down there.Copy !req
326. He had such a beautiful disposition.
It was unbelievable what I put him through.Copy !req
327. There was ice on the toilet in the morning.
I had to pee on top of ice.Copy !req
328. There was a sheet of ice there. And we
were playing this thing four hours long...Copy !req
329. to seven people in subzero weather
at this warehouse on a Sunday night.Copy !req
330. Seven people in the audience.
And my brother had been in Chile.Copy !req
331. Rocky had been in Chile for three years,
and he came back to see me.Copy !req
332. He hadn't seen me in three years, and in
order to deal with my new theatrical career...Copy !req
333. he sat in the front row and took notes
throughout the whole production.Copy !req
334. He was very intellectual.Copy !req
335. And the woman who was playing the mother
was swearing in the dressing room —Copy !req
336. "Who the fuck is that asshole
in the front row taking notes?Copy !req
337. We've already been reviewed!"Copy !req
338. She was throwing ashtrays
around the dressing room.Copy !req
339. I said, "It's my brother, Rocky."Copy !req
340. And when Rocky and I got home...Copy !req
341. the first thing he did
was give me his notes.Copy !req
342. After I left Rhode Island, you see,
I wanted to go across country...Copy !req
343. and I didn't have
enough money to do it.Copy !req
344. I had this fantasy idea
that I thought every great actor...Copy !req
345. should both play Hamlet in his lifetime
and also fuck on stage.Copy !req
346. You know, should run the gamut...Copy !req
347. or else try to incorporate both in Hamlet.Copy !req
348. But Hamlet wasn't playing this summer,
or I didn't know about any auditions for it...Copy !req
349. so I ended up — To try to make money,
I ended up applying for a pornographic
movie.Copy !req
350. And I got the role.
I was really surprised.Copy !req
351. She would work on us. She would
work on me, say, with her mouth...Copy !req
352. and him with the hand,
and then vice versa.Copy !req
353. And then as soon as I was up...Copy !req
354. I'd start down as he went up...Copy !req
355. and we would never get it together.Copy !req
356. So finally he said,
"Clear the room."Copy !req
357. So the director would go out of the room,
and we'd work together...Copy !req
358. and we'd both get up,
and he'd say...Copy !req
359. "All right. Quick.
Bring the cameras back."Copy !req
360. And by the time the camera's set up,
we'd be down again.Copy !req
361. So it was a lot of work.Copy !req
362. We finally finished the shot.
It took about all afternoon.Copy !req
363. The director was very upset
and running around me, saying...Copy !req
364. "Make more noise, Gray.
Make more faces."Copy !req
365. The Knack.Copy !req
366. Not a very good play by Ann Jellicoe.Copy !req
367. I happen to have a copy of it here.Copy !req
368. I was in this play
at Theatre by the Sea...Copy !req
369. in Portsmouth, New Hampshire.Copy !req
370. I thought I should have played
the role of Tolen...Copy !req
371. but I got cast as Colin,
who was the stud.Copy !req
372. My father brought my mother
to see this play...Copy !req
373. while she was having
an incurable nervous breakdown.Copy !req
374. She thought she was coming to see
Long Day's Journey Into Night.Copy !req
375. Now, that wasn't because she was
having a nervous breakdown.Copy !req
376. That came after this play.
It wasn't completely an illusion...Copy !req
377. but my father brought her to this
because he thought...Copy !req
378. Long Day's Journey
would upset her too much...Copy !req
379. and I'm afraid that
this one was worse.Copy !req
380. I'm right up to this section...Copy !req
381. where the character, Brewster,
is trying to get away from his mother.Copy !req
382. It's the summer of 1966. She's having
a very severe nervous breakdown.Copy !req
383. He's trying to help her through it.
At the same time, he's very aware...Copy !req
384. that he must flee the nest.Copy !req
385. He must run away and begin
his own life, or he won't have one.Copy !req
386. And he desperately
wants to become an actor...Copy !req
387. and he wants to get his actor's equity card
at the Alley Theatre that season.Copy !req
388. They have a very good reputation.
Also, what is very important for him...Copy !req
389. is that they're doing
Chekhov's play The Sea Gull...Copy !req
390. and he is sure
that he is perfect for the role...Copy !req
391. of Konstantin Gavrilovich Treplev,
the young writer...Copy !req
392. positive he'll be cast in it
because he's sensitive like Konstantin...Copy !req
393. his relationship to his mother
is not unlike Konstantin's to his mother...Copy !req
394. and the other thing is that Konstantin
gets to shoot himself in the head...Copy !req
395. at the end of every play and come back
the following night to play himself again.Copy !req
396. Brewster likes this.Copy !req
397. And I'm there with my mother
in Rhode Island...Copy !req
398. and she is going mad.Copy !req
399. She's having a nervous breakdown.
She's tearing her hair out
from the back of her head.Copy !req
400. And I'm trying to calm her down
by reading to her from Alan Watts's book...Copy !req
401. Psychotherapy East & West.Copy !req
402. Laboring under that romantic idea
of R.D. Laing's...Copy !req
403. how every person who has
a nervous breakdown is so lucky...Copy !req
404. 'cause they get to come out
the other side of it with such great wisdom...Copy !req
405. provided they come out
the other side.Copy !req
406. And I was trying to help my mother
through to the other side...Copy !req
407. but she wasn't listening to Alan Watts.Copy !req
408. She was reading from Science and Health
by Mary Baker Eddy...Copy !req
409. and from The Christian Science Monitor.Copy !req
410. And I remember that vividly,
that warm July day—Copy !req
411. she in her pajamas,
curled up on the couch...Copy !req
412. with The Christian Science Monitor
between us like a Japanese paper wall.Copy !req
413. And I am so annoyed finally
that I can't get through to her...Copy !req
414. that I reach down
and just flick the paper.Copy !req
415. And she pulls the paper down
and looks me right in the eyes and says...Copy !req
416. "How shall I do it, dear?Copy !req
417. How shall I do it?Copy !req
418. Shall I do it in the garage
with the car?"Copy !req
419. The day I found out was that —Copy !req
420. My father didn't tell me
over the phone.Copy !req
421. I'd called him from —
let's see, from Houston...Copy !req
422. 'cause I'd taken a train
up to Houston...Copy !req
423. and was gonna fly in
from Houston to Providence.Copy !req
424. And he picked me up.
It was a very hot August day.Copy !req
425. And I remember I had a bottle
of tequila in a brown bag.Copy !req
426. I'd been carrying it on the plane.Copy !req
427. And I was sipping it
outside the Providence airport.Copy !req
428. And he picked me up in his Ford LTD
with the air conditioner on.Copy !req
429. I remember it was very hot.
The windows were up.Copy !req
430. And he said,
"Tying one on, are you?"Copy !req
431. I had the bag of tequila...Copy !req
432. and we rode in silence for a bit,
and I said...Copy !req
433. "So how's Mom?"
'cause I knew she'd been having...Copy !req
434. this nervous breakdown
for two years...Copy !req
435. in and out of shock treatments.Copy !req
436. And he just started to —Copy !req
437. He broke down while he was driving.
He started to cry.Copy !req
438. Like, whimper.
It wasn't really full-blown.Copy !req
439. He said, "She's gone."Copy !req
440. And I remember,
looking back on it...Copy !req
441. turning to stone like a statue.Copy !req
442. And I just heard "gone."Gone."
I was trying to make sense of "gone."Copy !req
443. And I remember "gone,"
like "died of a broken heart."Copy !req
444. I heard that Grimm's fairy tale line.Copy !req
445. And then I had an image — and all of this
may be fictionalized since then.Copy !req
446. But this is what I remember.
I had an image of a dandelion...Copy !req
447. when it's turned to fluff
at the end of the —Copy !req
448. Gone. Just gone.Copy !req
449. Not "dead," not "killed herself."Copy !req
450. Again, that was avoidance language
that was going on in Rhode Island.Copy !req
451. And when my mother's obituary
appeared, it was "deceased"...Copy !req
452. and the rumors were she died of cancer.
There was no mention of suicide.Copy !req
453. So when I began to talk about it,
and the Providence Journal did...Copy !req
454. a profile about me
doing my first piece...Copy !req
455. Rumstick Road,
with the Wooster Group...Copy !req
456. in which we did an exploration
of my mother's suicide in 1967...Copy !req
457. as a group piece — with tape recordings
and slides — it was a mixed-media piece...Copy !req
458. and that really led me
into my monologues.Copy !req
459. When they did a profile in
the Providence Journal, it was scandalous.Copy !req
460. I mean, my relatives were upset
that it would come out...Copy !req
461. that it was this suicide.Copy !req
462. My mother committed suicide.
Shortly after she committed suicide...Copy !req
463. the woman down the road,
her husband drank himself to death.Copy !req
464. So my father and this woman got together
to try to make a good marriage...Copy !req
465. and forget about the pain
and move into a perfect house.Copy !req
466. They moved
into this kind of a ranch house...Copy !req
467. that was like a very modern,
fully equipped motel...Copy !req
468. where you pull in the asphalt driveway.
On the right is a huge tennis court.Copy !req
469. You pull in,
push a button in the car...Copy !req
470. one of the three cars,
a three-car garage door goes up.Copy !req
471. Three cars are in the garage.
You go around to the front door...Copy !req
472. ring the doorbell. It plays 40 different tunes.
My father's always adjusting them every day.Copy !req
473. That particular day it was the William Tell
Overture, or next day would be...Copy !req
474. "The Whole World is Waiting
for the Sunrise," with a polka beat...Copy !req
475. or it might be "Jingle Bell Rock,"
according to the seasons.Copy !req
476. And you go in and there's a whole
weather station there on your left...Copy !req
477. with the barometric pressure
and the wind velocity and the temperature.Copy !req
478. And it's wall-to-wall carpeting
and Muzak playing in all the rooms.Copy !req
479. And in their bedroom,
between the twin beds,
there's a little box that makes white sound.Copy !req
480. You can turn it to static, you can turn it
to water, you can turn it to wind.Copy !req
481. My father likes to sleep with the static.
Said he couldn't get to sleep without it.Copy !req
482. Down in the basement —
And everything is going fine.Copy !req
483. Down in the basement, there are
two freezers filled to the top with meat.Copy !req
484. Up in the attic, there are rows and rows
of bourbon, rows and rows of Scotch...Copy !req
485. rows and rows of gin,
just like a liquor warehouse.Copy !req
486. There's an automatic generator that goes
on automatic pilot when the lights go out.Copy !req
487. And everything is going fine,
and everything is going fine,
and the cocktail hour begins about 5:00.Copy !req
488. We usually start in front
of the TV with Zoom.Copy !req
489. And after Zoom,
6:00 news, the 6:30 news...Copy !req
490. the 7:00 news, and we're eating
somewhere around The Odd Couple.Copy !req
491. Now, I never know whether I'm talking to my
father, my stepmother, or The Odd Couple.Copy !req
492. It all kind of blends in.Copy !req
493. And everything is going fine,
except this particular day, it's summer...Copy !req
494. and we're eating outside,
and the only problem is flies.Copy !req
495. "There's a fly. Look out.
Close the door. Get out the bomber."Copy !req
496. My father got out this big fogger
and set it off by the picnic table out back...Copy !req
497. and my stepmother, who collects antiques,
got out the antique fly gun.Copy !req
498. You pull it back like this and line it up
a certain distance from the fly...Copy !req
499. and if you're all right,
the thing goes "thump."Copy !req
500. And everything is going fine,
and everything is going fine...Copy !req
501. except someone stole his flagpole twice
with the flag on it...Copy !req
502. so he's had to cement this one in,
and everything is going fine...Copy !req
503. except the swimming pool has cracks in it,
it's leaking, and the AstroTurf is shrinking.Copy !req
504. And everything is going fine,
and everything is going fine,
except for the squirrels...Copy !req
505. the gypsy moths,
and a pig farmer named Rocky.Copy !req
506. Now, these pigs — It's a good ways away,
but if the wind is wrong...Copy !req
507. you smell the garbage
when you're in the swimming pool.Copy !req
508. And this is driving them nuts,
because it's an imperfection, you see.Copy !req
509. It's an imperfection.
So what they found out was —Copy !req
510. They investigated.
There's a town ordinance...Copy !req
511. that you can't have pigs
next to private property.Copy !req
512. But there's a good chunk of very expensive
property between their property
and Rocky the pig farmer.Copy !req
513. And there's another problem too,
because my father's name is Rocky.Copy !req
514. So there's a very big, expensive piece
of property between there and there...Copy !req
515. and so they go down and buy it,
and the next day they take Rocky to court —Copy !req
516. the pig farmer — and they say,
"You can't have pigs next to our property."Copy !req
517. He says, "You don't own that property."
And he says...Copy !req
518. "We bought it this morning, my friend."Copy !req
519. It was 1967...Copy !req
520. and I just escaped the draft
by the skin of my... whatever —Copy !req
521. chance, luck —
that I didn't go to Vietnam...Copy !req
522. and I got very disillusioned
with theater, regional theater...Copy !req
523. and the lack of adventure...Copy !req
524. and experimentation,
and I started reading...Copy !req
525. about Andre Gregory being thrown
out of Theatre for the Living Arts...Copy !req
526. for doing Rochelle Owens's play,
Beclch.Copy !req
527. And the board of directors had fired him.
He'd gone to New York City
to start a company.Copy !req
528. So I read that in The New York Times,
and I thought...Copy !req
529. "Well, someone's getting fired
for doing something.Copy !req
530. I wonder what that something is, and I'm
gonna take a check-out in New York City."Copy !req
531. My first publicity shot
in New York City.Copy !req
532. I didn't know who to go to
when I came here.Copy !req
533. I just took a Backstage magazine,
you know, and I took it out.Copy !req
534. I took the first ad
that said "photographer."Copy !req
535. I go. This guy must have had...Copy !req
536. his great-grandfather's camera
from the Civil War.Copy !req
537. He had a canopy he threw over his head,
and there was a wooden cup over the lens...Copy !req
538. and he took it off and counted
the exposure — one, two —Copy !req
539. and then put it back like this.Copy !req
540. A 1969 publicity shot.Copy !req
541. I was doing a workshop
with the Open Theater...Copy !req
542. which was an experimental group
run by Joe Chaikin...Copy !req
543. and Joyce Aaron was running
the workshop as a free, open workshop...Copy !req
544. and we were asked —
and this was in 1969, in New York City—Copy !req
545. to come in and just bring in
a story and jam on it...Copy !req
546. in a kind of way that if you didn't remember
the whole story, you could repeat a word.Copy !req
547. And I didn't repeat anything once.Copy !req
548. I just did a story of my day
as fast as I could speak it.Copy !req
549. And at the end of the workshop,
Joyce, who was running it...Copy !req
550. asked me who wrote it.Copy !req
551. She thought it had been
prewritten and memorized.Copy !req
552. And in 1969, I had a little hint...Copy !req
553. that I had some sort of talent
for storytelling...Copy !req
554. but there was no place for it then,
and it didn't come out till ten years later.Copy !req
555. It wasn't my choice to go to India.
I was going with a performance group
to do Brecht's Mother Courage.Copy !req
556. I don't know why.Copy !req
557. We had gotten
a John D. Rockefeller III travel grant...Copy !req
558. to do this.
That paid for our tickets over.Copy !req
559. But when I was in India — I began
searching for a guru when I was in India...Copy !req
560. because, well, I started getting
interested in tantric gurus.Copy !req
561. I was looking for tantric masters
because I had become...Copy !req
562. sexually obsessed in India.Copy !req
563. I think it had to do
with the fact that I knew...Copy !req
564. there was a lot of sexuality
going on in the country...Copy !req
565. because there were so many people
and so many children...Copy !req
566. but I didn't know where it was operative...Copy !req
567. where it was happening.Copy !req
568. I couldn't understand it
through my cultural view of my eyes.Copy !req
569. And so I was searching around for these
tantric masters that could teach me...Copy !req
570. and there were supposed to be
a few tantric masters left...Copy !req
571. that practiced this tantric sexuality.Copy !req
572. You get in a tantric pose
and you say...Copy !req
573. "I am one who is doing this."
You know, "I am one —"Copy !req
574. and then you don't spread any—
waste any seed.Copy !req
575. I waited two weeks,
applied for an audience.Copy !req
576. And then what you have to do
is you must come to his gate...Copy !req
577. around 6:00 out back, because
you go around the back of his house.Copy !req
578. And you're not to wear
any scented soaps...Copy !req
579. or perfume or shaving lotion,
anything — or cut flowers —Copy !req
580. because any kind of scent...Copy !req
581. will cause the guru to leave his body.Copy !req
582. And he had been leaving it by accident,
you know, as a result of these scents...Copy !req
583. and the sannyasis were afraid
he wouldn't come back.Copy !req
584. Some people came and knelt,
and he shone a little penlight in their eye...Copy !req
585. and then gave them a holy name
and put the mala around.Copy !req
586. Well, when I knelt down, it was obvious
I wasn't about to take the mala.Copy !req
587. I really wanted to just say,
"Look, which workshop is the orgy?"Copy !req
588. I met this American expatriate
on the plane that was living in Paris...Copy !req
589. and he had friends
down in Greece.Copy !req
590. He said, "No problem at all. Come with me.
Take a room in the hotel I'm staying in...Copy !req
591. and then we'll go out to eat,
we'll have some drinks.Copy !req
592. You go up and see the ruins first.
Then we'll meet, have drinks and eat."Copy !req
593. By then, I knew that this guy
was a homosexual. He was gay.Copy !req
594. He told me, "It's much better to be gay
if you're traveling a lot, you know?Copy !req
595. It's just much more convenient.
You have more sexual activity."Copy !req
596. "Oh, really?" I said.
"Yeah," he said. "No, this is true."Copy !req
597. I got into bed,
and I started feeling — mm —Copy !req
598. that kind of springtime feeling
in the base of my spine, a little slight itch.Copy !req
599. And I thought, uh...Copy !req
600. "I wonder why he didn't
try to seduce me.Copy !req
601. What's wrong with me?"Copy !req
602. "What's wrong with him?"Copy !req
603. And I thought,
"Maybe I should go ask him.Copy !req
604. Yeah."Copy !req
605. So I got up, I got dressed...Copy !req
606. and I went out
and I knocked on his door.Copy !req
607. He said, "Who is it?"
I said, "Spalding."Copy !req
608. He said, "Come in."
So I kind of went along the wall.Copy !req
609. I came in, and I said...Copy !req
610. "We've got to, uh, do something."Copy !req
611. He said, "Uh, go take a shower.Copy !req
612. You can use my shower,
and then we'll talk."Copy !req
613. So I came out of the shower
dripping, and, um —Copy !req
614. Look, I figured it was safe.Copy !req
615. He was clean.Copy !req
616. He was nice. He was —Copy !req
617. It was better than one of those —
It was a private room.Copy !req
618. I figured I was going to be
traveling in Greece.Copy !req
619. I might as well get initiated.Copy !req
620. And, uh...Copy !req
621. I thought it was better than one of those
steamy New York City gay baths...Copy !req
622. and, uh —Copy !req
623. And who would ever know?Copy !req
624. So he said,
"What do you like to do?"Copy !req
625. And I said, "Oh, huh."Copy !req
626. "I don't know. I don't know.
What do you like to do?"Copy !req
627. He said, "Oh, I like
having my cock sucked."Copy !req
628. I said...Copy !req
629. "I would never do that."Copy !req
630. Next thing I knew, I was in bed with him,
like on automatic pilot.Copy !req
631. It was such a surprise.
I was in there, I had my arms around him...Copy !req
632. and it was a real surprise,
because he was soft like a woman.Copy !req
633. His skin was very soft,
and it was good to be next to someone...Copy !req
634. after traveling around
all that time and just —Copy !req
635. But I didn't relax with it, you know?
It was too much for me just then...Copy !req
636. and I just went right down on him.Copy !req
637. I didn't waste any more time.
And while I was doing it...Copy !req
638. I was thinking in my head
all the time like this:Copy !req
639. "I am a homosexual, I am a homosexual,
I am a homosexual, I am a homosexual...Copy !req
640. I am a homosexual,
I am a homosexual."Copy !req
641. And suddenly it broke
like a bubble in my head, you know...Copy !req
642. and I was suddenly
finding myself sucking...Copy !req
643. on this kind of disconnected
rubber garden hose...Copy !req
644. semi-choking.Copy !req
645. And — I don't know. Some of you
may know what I'm talking about.Copy !req
646. This disconnected feeling.Copy !req
647. He said, "Oh!"
He caught on.Copy !req
648. He said
"Spalding, ease down, ease down.Copy !req
649. You don't have to do anything
you don't want to do.Copy !req
650. I mean, there's no sense
torturing yourself.Copy !req
651. Is there?"Copy !req
652. Every morning I was calling up
and saying to the airplane...Copy !req
653. "This is Mr. Gray. I have an open ticket.
I'd like to fly at 6:00 tonight."Copy !req
654. "Anything you say, Mr. Gray.
You have an open ticket."Copy !req
655. And I'd go have a couple beers,
and I'd think about Greece...Copy !req
656. and I'd come back and call and say,
"No, cancel it. I'm going to fly another time."Copy !req
657. "Anything you say, Mr. Gray.
You have an open ticket."Copy !req
658. I was beginning to like this, you know?Copy !req
659. No. It was more power
than I'd had in all my life.Copy !req
660. Big Royal Dutch 747.Copy !req
661. So Liz said,
"You better go back with me."Copy !req
662. I said, "Sure.
You make the reservation. You do it.Copy !req
663. You call them, tell them we'll show up."
We showed up at the airport, right?Copy !req
664. We got to the airport, and I started pacing
around. She said, "What's wrong?"Copy !req
665. I said, "I can't go. I have to go — I —"Copy !req
666. And she said, "Wait a minute.
You'd better get your bags off the plane."Copy !req
667. So I went over to the woman and said,
"Can you —"Copy !req
668. "No, skip it. Just leave my bags on.
I'm not going."Copy !req
669. She said, "I'm sorry, Mr. Gray.
You have to accompany your bags
back to New York City.Copy !req
670. They can't go without you."
I said, "Can you take them off?"Copy !req
671. She said, "I think we can."
She got her walkie-talkie out.Copy !req
672. - She said, "Do you want —"
- I said, "Yes. No. Uh —Copy !req
673. Yes. No."Copy !req
674. I started barking at her.
It was unbelievable.Copy !req
675. And her eyes were rolling in her head,
and Liz just walked on ahead...Copy !req
676. as though she didn't know me,
you know?Copy !req
677. I had a rather —Copy !req
678. a kind of nervous collapse that lasted
maybe four or five months.Copy !req
679. A lot of not being able to stay awake
and very depressed...Copy !req
680. and it was triggered
by a lot of regret, of saying...Copy !req
681. "I should've done this in India, and
I could've done that, and I didn't do that"...Copy !req
682. rather than looking
at things I did do.Copy !req
683. So coming out of that breakdown,
I started keeping a journal, a diary.Copy !req
684. And it was just a regular diary.
That was a real daily diary.Copy !req
685. And each morning
I would write in that day...Copy !req
686. saying, "This is what
I did the day before."Copy !req
687. I let sleep be the filter system.Copy !req
688. And it was healing
in the sense of saying...Copy !req
689. "This is what I did,
not what I didn't do."Copy !req
690. This developed a very—Copy !req
691. And this was seven years
I did this without missing a day.Copy !req
692. And this developed a terrific...Copy !req
693. like almost "cinemagraphic"
or photographic memory for detail.Copy !req
694. And slowly I began to understand
that what my art form was —Copy !req
695. and bless them,
it was the Wooster Group...Copy !req
696. that pushed me
and was the first audience.Copy !req
697. Elizabeth LeCompte and I
had some time on our own...Copy !req
698. to develop our own pieces, and we just
started playing around in the garage.Copy !req
699. And we began to use
my memories and life experiencesCopy !req
700. as a kind of source material
to build our pieces on.Copy !req
701. We did a trilogy called
Three Places in Rhode Island...Copy !req
702. and Liz LeCompte and the group
would tape-record them...Copy !req
703. transcribe them,
and I'd look at them and go...Copy !req
704. "Aha! That's writing!"Copy !req
705. And what happened was that the writer's
voice began to push the actor's voice out.Copy !req
706. When I say "writer's voice,"
what do I mean?Copy !req
707. I couldn't spell.
I couldn't write. I could barely read.Copy !req
708. I didn't know that had
nothing to do with writing.Copy !req
709. This self-reflector's
writer's voice began to —Copy !req
710. I couldn't memorize my texts properly.Copy !req
711. I was always interpolating
or adding my own words.Copy !req
712. So the little voice began
to whisper to me...Copy !req
713. "What if, in fact, you were
speaking your own words?Copy !req
714. What would they be?"
And I began to do that.Copy !req
715. In 1979, at the Performing Garage
in downtown Manhattan...Copy !req
716. I did my first monologue
and called it...Copy !req
717. Sex and Death to the Age 14.Copy !req
718. I sat down at this table in front of
whoever came. It was word of mouth.Copy !req
719. Maybe there were 15 or 16 people there,
or less — or 12 people —Copy !req
720. and I put on the Donna Diana Overture
and just played the opening...Copy !req
721. and lifted the needle,
and I had my little outline...Copy !req
722. and it was everything I could remember
about sex and death till the age 14...Copy !req
723. which was the name of the monologue,
and I tape-recorded it.Copy !req
724. And the first night it was maybe,
oh, 50 minutes long.Copy !req
725. Then I went back and listened to the tape,
and I had all these massive...Copy !req
726. associations and memories
and restructured the outline.Copy !req
727. Went back the next night.
It was 60 minutes.Copy !req
728. Then it was an hour and five,
hour and ten, hour and 30 —Copy !req
729. almost all 19 monologues
have come in at an hour and 30 —Copy !req
730. and it just fell into that form, and it became
my first autobiographic monologue.Copy !req
731. And what it did was trigger
enormous amounts of memory.Copy !req
732. I went right on to the next one,
Booze, Cars, and College Girls...Copy !req
733. then A Personal History
of the American Theater.Copy !req
734. But, you see, this unlocked
a whole new method of working.Copy !req
735. I became
like an inverted method actor.Copy !req
736. You see?Copy !req
737. I was using myself to play myself.Copy !req
738. I was playing with myself.Copy !req
739. It was a kind of creative narcissism.
And this began to develop, you see?Copy !req
740. More memories came, and I began
to develop this little cottage industry.Copy !req
741. And I began to tour.Copy !req
742. Wherever people would ask me to go,
I'd take these monologues.Copy !req
743. And sometimes I'd go out alone.
Sometimes I'd go with my girlfriend, Renée.Copy !req
744. Now how did you meet?Copy !req
745. Oh, God, we met in Studio 54.Copy !req
746. Couldn't have been
a more ludicrous meeting place.Copy !req
747. I mean, it was a downtown
celebration of the arts.Copy !req
748. I got an arts award, and we were —Copy !req
749. I saw her across a crowded room,
and her face lit up, and I loved it —Copy !req
750. a very open, soulful face.Copy !req
751. And I asked her to dance...Copy !req
752. and she said
I tried to come on too much.Copy !req
753. I was, like, too physical
with her, and she fled.Copy !req
754. She thought I was married.
I wasn't.Copy !req
755. I was living with someone at the time,
but we were breaking up.Copy !req
756. And I pursued her and I found her,
and we had a date...Copy !req
757. and we went out,
and those were the days —Copy !req
758. I think on the first date
we were back in bed...Copy !req
759. and she was nervous and drank
the wrong drinks and said...Copy !req
760. "Excuse me.
I'm gonna throw up."Copy !req
761. So in the middle of our first
making love, she threw up...Copy !req
762. and I held her head
and put a pot under it...Copy !req
763. and that was
our bonding, I think.Copy !req
764. We bonded around that vomiting.Copy !req
765. And we had a horrible fight
when we started out.Copy !req
766. I think it was, Renée missed
her New York support system.Copy !req
767. That was the first item.
Then she said that sex was a red herring...Copy !req
768. and we started talking
about what a red herring was.Copy !req
769. And then she said,
"But we're not equals, you see?"Copy !req
770. And then she finally said, "Look...Copy !req
771. I feel like I'm driving you
3,000 miles to work!"Copy !req
772. See?Copy !req
773. I started asserting myself,
you know?Copy !req
774. I said, "I don't give a shit if you go, really.
I can't take this arguing anymore."Copy !req
775. And my assertion made us both
incredibly horny, and we, uh...Copy !req
776. we pulled the car over, and we had
the best sex of the whole trip, you know?Copy !req
777. It had nothing to do with positions
or where the car was parked.Copy !req
778. It was just something —Copy !req
779. I get tired of talking about myself.Copy !req
780. And when I do, I do
the conversations with the audience...Copy !req
781. and it's a way of getting outside
of myself and hopefully empathizing...Copy !req
782. with another person's story.Copy !req
783. So the conversations
are always guided...Copy !req
784. toward trying to bring up
a story in someone...Copy !req
785. about whatever topic
we're dwelling on that day.Copy !req
786. It's a beautiful piece...Copy !req
787. because people don't have
any public conversations in America.Copy !req
788. They're always 12-step programs.
They always have an agenda.Copy !req
789. There is no agenda in this.Copy !req
790. And the audience has to find
what's interesting for them.Copy !req
791. They have to do the editing,
you know?Copy !req
792. And they will or they won't.
They're in and out of it.Copy !req
793. Some people
are more interesting than others.Copy !req
794. But I've gotten more intuitive
of choosing people that will be able...Copy !req
795. to be communicative
and come out, you know?Copy !req
796. - Did you try to kill yourself?
- No. No, no, no.Copy !req
797. It was — I would never kill —
I mean —Copy !req
798. You never tried to kill yourself?Copy !req
799. Um, never.Copy !req
800. - Mm. Did you think about it?
- No. I, um —Copy !req
801. I think it's a real bad joke.Copy !req
802. - Huh? You think it's a bad joke?
- Yeah.Copy !req
803. - You don't like it.
- I don't like it. It's a real bad joke.Copy !req
804. Real, you know, bad joke.Copy !req
805. I get — And makes me angry.Copy !req
806. No, it's the least you can do.
It's so short, you know?Copy !req
807. It's the least you can do.
Just hang in.Copy !req
808. You never know, you know?
You just never know.Copy !req
809. Do you know anyone
that's ever killed themselves?Copy !req
810. You know, that guy I was married to
the first time, he did.Copy !req
811. - Just two or three years ago.
- He killed himself?Copy !req
812. And I haven't seen him
for 20 years, or 30.Copy !req
813. And it's been very upsetting
to think, you know —Copy !req
814. I hadn't seen him.
I hadn't thought about him.Copy !req
815. He did that.
And it's true: It does have a kicker.Copy !req
816. I mean —Copy !req
817. If you can't make it any other way,
you can do it that way.Copy !req
818. It's gonna have a real impact,
but it's a shock.Copy !req
819. It just doesn't — doesn't do it.Copy !req
820. Mm.Copy !req
821. But it, like, removes things.
It doesn't add.Copy !req
822. - I just don't like it. It scares me.
- Right.Copy !req
823. - I don't want you to do it. Anybody.
- Right.Copy !req
824. That's all.Copy !req
825. I was taking them on.
I was taking on their stories.Copy !req
826. - I was interviewing them onstage.
- Who were you interviewing?Copy !req
827. I was interviewing people
from the streets of L.A.Copy !req
828. I was interviewing a woman who had just
been picked up in a mother ship...Copy !req
829. a flying saucer
on the Ventura Freeway...Copy !req
830. and her car was going west,
and then an hour later it was going east...Copy !req
831. and she had to be deprogrammed
to figure out she'd been on a spaceship.Copy !req
832. So the next person
I have in is a person...Copy !req
833. who's the head
of the Aetherius Church out there...Copy !req
834. that believes flying saucers
are 15,000 miles up...Copy !req
835. above the Earth,
sending down positive energy.Copy !req
836. In this church, they have
a big battery that looks kind of like...Copy !req
837. a small radiator on stilts...Copy !req
838. and they receive the energy
from these flying saucers.Copy !req
839. Then, when there's a natural disaster
in the United States, they aim the battery.Copy !req
840. They go up and aim it at that disaster
and send out the positive energy.Copy !req
841. I say to him, "Wait, have any of your people
ever been picked up by flying saucers?"Copy !req
842. He said,
"No, they're 15,000 miles up."Copy !req
843. I said, "We had a woman in here the other
night that was on a ship," and he goes...Copy !req
844. - "Crazy."
- She's nuts. She's nuts.Copy !req
845. Do you have any fears?Copy !req
846. No. Well, actually, yeah.Copy !req
847. What?Copy !req
848. Going home and getting beat up —
beaten up.Copy !req
849. - Have you ever been beat up?
- Once.Copy !req
850. What happened? People —
Who beat you up?Copy !req
851. - People.
- Yeah.Copy !req
852. Large people. Yeah.Copy !req
853. A large gang of people.Copy !req
854. Was there any way
of getting back at them?Copy !req
855. - Me?
- Yeah.Copy !req
856. No. By myself?Copy !req
857. - Right.
- No.Copy !req
858. Did you talk to your father about it,
or anyone bigger?Copy !req
859. No.Copy !req
860. I couldn't.
Well, never mind.Copy !req
861. You kept it a secret?Copy !req
862. - Yeah.
- Right.Copy !req
863. Well, now I'm not.
It's on television now.Copy !req
864. Are there any secrets
that I have?Copy !req
865. Are there stories that I don't tell?Copy !req
866. Yes.Copy !req
867. If I'm going into a situation
that I know is gonna be loaded...Copy !req
868. like the making of The Killing Fields,
for instance...Copy !req
869. I kept a pretty tight diary
for the facts, for the details.Copy !req
870. Then, when I get home from
The Killing Fields, three months after...Copy !req
871. because I do refer to myself
as a poetic journalist...Copy !req
872. in the sense
that any good journalist...Copy !req
873. would try to get the story in
as quickly as possible...Copy !req
874. I am working on a story,
but I like it to gel...Copy !req
875. and sit in my unconscious or my dream
state or my regular life for a while...Copy !req
876. and then after three months' time,
I'll make an outline.Copy !req
877. Swimming was a radical — and I'd always
been rooting for that — breakthrough.Copy !req
878. So I was out in L.A.,
performing at the Mark Taper Forum...Copy !req
879. Taper Two,
Swimming to Cambodia...Copy !req
880. and of course, I was in film land,
and everyone was approaching me...Copy !req
881. and they were doing,
"Let's just get it down real quick on 16 mm.Copy !req
882. Don't bother with the contract.
We want to just document this."Copy !req
883. And Renée said,
"You take control.Copy !req
884. You got everyone wanting to do it.
I'll produce it.Copy !req
885. You choose the director."Copy !req
886. It really reached a larger audience,
and I became more popular.Copy !req
887. Did you read any of
Swimming to Cambodia?Copy !req
888. I read about half of it.
I should have read it all...Copy !req
889. but I got involved with other things,
and I like it very much.Copy !req
890. - You were able to read it, though.
- Oh, it's very amusing in places.Copy !req
891. I can just picture some of these things,
doing them myself.Copy !req
892. Really?Copy !req
893. Well, those scenes in New York...Copy !req
894. where you would go down the street
snapping your fingers three times...Copy !req
895. or six times or whatever
for some reason —Copy !req
896. - I've forgotten what it was now.
- The compulsive behavior.Copy !req
897. Yeah, but I've done
the same thing myself...Copy !req
898. - Yeah.
- when I was younger.Copy !req
899. Now you're over it, right?Copy !req
900. I like telling the story of life
better than I do living it.Copy !req
901. I'm very reflective.Copy !req
902. I mean, I just enjoy telling the story,
and the event feeds that.Copy !req
903. But how does that quell
your fears of living?Copy !req
904. Uh, control.
See, I'm afraid of life.Copy !req
905. I don't know how you deal with this,
but everything is chance.Copy !req
906. It's a miracle to me that I'm here,
that the plane made it.Copy !req
907. That the sun came up.Copy !req
908. As soon as you don't have any form
of God or meaning in your life...Copy !req
909. then you make it up
as you go along.Copy !req
910. And certainly, doing the monologue is
making it up, getting control over it...Copy !req
911. giving it structure to what is normally
chaos to me every day.Copy !req
912. The monologue you're going to hear
tonight is a monologue about a man...Copy !req
913. who can't write a book about a man
who can't take a vacation.Copy !req
914. Now, as soon as I signed
the contract for the book...Copy !req
915. I decided that I would give up
doing monologues.Copy !req
916. I'd just completely give them up.
I felt they were making me too extroverted.Copy !req
917. Perhaps even pandering.Copy !req
918. And what I wanted to do was pull in
to my more introverted self...Copy !req
919. that I hadn't been in touch with
in 20 years...Copy !req
920. and just begin to work
on writing in a private way...Copy !req
921. and go away to a writers' colony,
if I could get in one...Copy !req
922. 'cause I thought that would prove
I was a writer if they'd accept me...Copy !req
923. and just write the book.Copy !req
924. No living. Just writing.Copy !req
925. And finally I did get down to the writing,
and I got down to it, and it was awful.Copy !req
926. I don't know why I'd romanticized it.
It's disgusting.Copy !req
927. Writing is like a disease.
It is a disease.Copy !req
928. It steals your body from you.
There's no audience.Copy !req
929. There's no feedback.
There's — There's —Copy !req
930. It's —
My hand was swelling up —Copy !req
931. my knuckle, from the pen pressing
against it, 'cause I was writing longhand.Copy !req
932. I was losing my sight in my left eye.Copy !req
933. I was going blind in my left eye,
which was horrible for me...Copy !req
934. because here I was,
working on all my Oedipal themes.Copy !req
935. And I thought...Copy !req
936. "There goes the first eye."Copy !req
937. Which is more frightening —Copy !req
938. to go out on a stage as yourself...Copy !req
939. or to go out on a stage
as a character?Copy !req
940. Well, it's flip-flopped.
Now it's more frightening...Copy !req
941. to go out on the stage
as a character, because I was —Copy !req
942. I got to the point, I think,
that I was hiding behind myself.Copy !req
943. The self became like a mask.
Not hiding...Copy !req
944. but there was a persona there
that I was working behind.Copy !req
945. Now I'm playing. Now I am rehearsing
for the role of the caretaker...Copy !req
946. in the Broadway revival of Our Town...Copy !req
947. that's going on at the Lyceum,
and I'm terrified.Copy !req
948. - Why?
- Because I am having to do...Copy !req
949. a role that's not dissimilar
from myself...Copy !req
950. but I'm having to say someone else's
words, and in a very tight girdle.Copy !req
951. And I have this terrific
rebellious feeling...Copy !req
952. like I had back in school...Copy !req
953. to do a parody of the play—
My subconscious —Copy !req
954. I want to tell a story about —
I'm discursive.Copy !req
955. I'm associative.
That's how I work.Copy !req
956. So every time I say a line
from Our Town, I have an association...Copy !req
957. and I start spinning off on that association,
and I'm having all these internal films.Copy !req
958. I'm really supposed to be
just speaking the lines.Copy !req
959. So it is going to be —
It's like putting on a girdle.Copy !req
960. It's gonna be very, very difficult for me
to do this. I'm very nervous about it.Copy !req
961. The little boy playing Wally Webb
over here, Emily's brother...Copy !req
962. whose appendix burst in New Hampshire
on a Scout trip — he's 11 years old.Copy !req
963. He is not blinking an eye for 40 minutes
while I talk about eternity and say...Copy !req
964. "You know as well as I do...Copy !req
965. that the dead don't stay interested
in us living for very long.Copy !req
966. Gradually, gradually,
they lose hold of the earth...Copy !req
967. and the pleasures they had,
and the things they suffered...Copy !req
968. and the people they loved,
and the ambitions they had.Copy !req
969. They get weaned away
from the earth."Copy !req
970. That's the way I put it —
"weaned away."Copy !req
971. Except often when you're doing
a long run, you often have...Copy !req
972. what I refer to as
a "unifying accident"...Copy !req
973. in which something so strange
happens on the stage that it suddenly...Copy !req
974. unifies the audience
and the cast in a realization...Copy !req
975. that we are only here together
in this one moment, for this show.Copy !req
976. It's not television.
It's not a film.Copy !req
977. Because of the nature of the accident, we all
know it will never be repeated, most likely.Copy !req
978. And somewhere
in the middle of the run, it happens.Copy !req
979. I'm turning to the dead, saying,
"They're waiting.Copy !req
980. They're waiting for something
they feel is coming.Copy !req
981. Something important and great."Copy !req
982. And I turn to watch them wait,
and just as I turn...Copy !req
983. the little 11-year-old boy
projectile-vomits.Copy !req
984. Like a hydrant it comes,
hitting one of the dead on the shoulder.Copy !req
985. The other dead levitate around him
out of sheer fear and drop back down.Copy !req
986. Frannie Conroy in the front row,
in deep meditative trance, is thinking...Copy !req
987. "Why is it raining onstage?"Copy !req
988. The little boy flees from his chair,
vomit pouring from his mouth.Copy !req
989. Splatter, splatter, splatter!
My knees are shaking.Copy !req
990. The chair is empty.Copy !req
991. The audience is thunderstruck.Copy !req
992. There is not a sound
coming from the audience...Copy !req
993. except for one little
ten-year-old boy in the eighth row.Copy !req
994. He knows what he saw.Copy !req
995. He is laughing!Copy !req
996. And I don't know what to do.Copy !req
997. I don't know whether to go on
with Thornton Wilder and be loyal to him...Copy !req
998. and do the next line as written...Copy !req
999. or attempt what might be
one of the most creative improvs...Copy !req
1000. in the history
of American theater.Copy !req
1001. And I decide to be loyal to Wilder
and go on with the next line...Copy !req
1002. and turn to that empty chair and say...Copy !req
1003. "Aren't they waiting for the eternal part
of them to come out clear?"Copy !req
1004. When I think of
Monster in a Box...Copy !req
1005. the film, which is
being released...Copy !req
1006. any day now...Copy !req
1007. I have a story that I tell over
and over again that I think I know...Copy !req
1008. because I've told the story...Copy !req
1009. and it has to do with how,
at the end —Copy !req
1010. I talk about when I came home
from Mexico on my vacation...Copy !req
1011. all I found left about my mother —
'cause she committed suicide...Copy !req
1012. and had been cremated —
was ashes in an urn...Copy !req
1013. in a box by my father's bed.Copy !req
1014. And I'd tell that story over and over
again, and then I suddenly realized...Copy !req
1015. how long he actually kept
that box by the bed...Copy !req
1016. before casting
the ashes over the sea...Copy !req
1017. and what a kind of
loving gesture it was.Copy !req
1018. And I'd seen it just that —
He wasn't procrastinating or waiting...Copy !req
1019. but he was actually
living with...Copy !req
1020. and sleeping
next to those ashes.Copy !req
1021. And it was just
a very strong, powerful image —Copy !req
1022. the thought of him alone
with that box at night.Copy !req
1023. And I never, never really felt it...Copy !req
1024. or looked into it until I had
spoken it so many times.Copy !req
1025. And yet the box
in which you put the fragments...Copy !req
1026. that will contribute to your next work —
is that a monster too?Copy !req
1027. Yes, and I've only started doing that
with the box since Monster in a Box.Copy !req
1028. I got a box and put it by my—
It was a new idea...Copy !req
1029. and I think it grew
out of that, yeah.Copy !req
1030. Is the monster of those fragments —
is that chaos?Copy !req
1031. Yes, that's what it is. And of course
it's all about organizing that...Copy !req
1032. and how frightening that is,
and why any artist is an artist...Copy !req
1033. and what their main work is to —Copy !req
1034. Yeah, that chaos is —
Yeah.Copy !req
1035. I just feel that all the time
when I'm not performing or organizing.Copy !req
1036. I'm out there in it, but it's what makes
the monologue, so I try to keep a journal.Copy !req
1037. What next? What to do?Copy !req
1038. Another monologue.
What else is there to do?Copy !req
1039. There's always a new crisis,
a new "impingency."Copy !req
1040. I hoped I wasn't making them up,
creating them just so I'd have material.Copy !req
1041. The new one was that I was losing
my sight in my left eye.Copy !req
1042. I certainly hoped I wasn't bringing
that one on myself for material.Copy !req
1043. And I did a monologue about it
and called it Gray's Anatomy.Copy !req
1044. Gray's Anatomy was gonna be
a cover story for The New York Times.Copy !req
1045. I said, "It's not ready." My agent said,
"It's for The New York Times, a cover story."Copy !req
1046. I said, "It doesn't exist yet."
She said, "Well, make it exist!"Copy !req
1047. I said, "I don't have a performance until
March." She said, "That's too late. Make it."Copy !req
1048. So I hired an editor,
John Howell, a friend of mine.Copy !req
1049. He sat across from me,
and I told him the story.Copy !req
1050. He was my first audience.
Just like you, it was one-on-one...Copy !req
1051. but I was telling the story
from an outline.Copy !req
1052. It's oral composition.Copy !req
1053. I was about to turn 52...Copy !req
1054. and clearly I had —Copy !req
1055. My mom killed herself
when she was 52...Copy !req
1056. and I had, somewhere in the back
of my mind, thought I was gonna —Copy !req
1057. in my "un," perhaps —
going to do it too.Copy !req
1058. Now, I had witnessed
two severe nervous breakdowns...Copy !req
1059. the second one
ending in her suicide...Copy !req
1060. so I was very attuned to it...Copy !req
1061. and was so sure that I was going
to join her either unconsciously...Copy !req
1062. where I would contract
some disease...Copy !req
1063. or in an accident,
or maybe just actually do a suicide.Copy !req
1064. And around this time, what began
to happen was suicide fantasies.Copy !req
1065. Like films.
I mean, I wasn't manufacturing them.Copy !req
1066. They were coming into my consciousness,
and I was watching them...Copy !req
1067. and embracing them as fantasies
and nothing more.Copy !req
1068. I mean, the first one I remember was,
I was touring Ireland with Renée...Copy !req
1069. and we went down to the Cliffs of Moher,
those 400-foot-high rock cliffs...Copy !req
1070. at sunset, you know —
an Irish sunset —Copy !req
1071. gray sky over gray sea.Copy !req
1072. Gray observed by Gray.Copy !req
1073. And I was standing there —
it was cocktail hour —Copy !req
1074. drinking a can of Guinness Stout,
looking out over —Copy !req
1075. Most of the tourists had gone.
And this fantasy came to me...Copy !req
1076. this desire to commit what I would call
a "Roadrunner suicide"...Copy !req
1077. in which I got back in a field,
and shot by Renée full speed —Copy !req
1078. beep-beep! voom! —
out over the cliff.Copy !req
1079. And just before I went down,
I turned and saw her face...Copy !req
1080. and it was that expression
on her face that I took with me...Copy !req
1081. as my last vision
to my watery grave.Copy !req
1082. And as I thought about this,
I couldn't stop crying...Copy !req
1083. and I could not stop
telling Renée the fantasy...Copy !req
1084. over and over...Copy !req
1085. and over again.Copy !req
1086. Now, around the time I was being
plagued by these silly fantasies...Copy !req
1087. a very powerful
synchronistic event happened.Copy !req
1088. Steven Soderbergh, the film director of
Sex, Lies, and Videotape and Kafka...Copy !req
1089. approached me to be in his new film,
King of the Hill.Copy !req
1090. And he said he was choosing me
for the particular role of Mr. Mungo...Copy !req
1091. because he'd read my book
Impossible Vacation.Copy !req
1092. "What a strange way to cast," I thought.
"From this book!"Copy !req
1093. And he said the character
in Impossible Vacation —Copy !req
1094. the "character," right? —
Brewster North —Copy !req
1095. was clearly ruled by regret...Copy !req
1096. and the character in his movie,
Mr. Mungo, that he wanted me to play...Copy !req
1097. was ruled by regret
to the extent that he kills himself.Copy !req
1098. "Oh, really?"Copy !req
1099. "And how does he do that, Steven?"Copy !req
1100. "Right now
I have him slitting his wrists."Copy !req
1101. "I'll do it!"Copy !req
1102. So here was a chance, I thought,
to work out this fantasy in a creative way...Copy !req
1103. with a good director.Copy !req
1104. I think it's a watershed monologue.
I think the other monologues...Copy !req
1105. were always about me being the victim
and having the audience be the mother...Copy !req
1106. and me crying out,
"Look, look, I'm drowning."Copy !req
1107. And also in my relationship
with Renée Shafransky...Copy !req
1108. which was similar to with the audience,
of always being...Copy !req
1109. in need of being nurtured
and mothered.Copy !req
1110. And in this monologue, I say...Copy !req
1111. "Hey, I did this,"
and I take more responsibility.Copy !req
1112. My shadow's showing in this.
I mean, I'm not a good guy.Copy !req
1113. Renée knew I had affairs.
She was not happy about it.Copy !req
1114. She had some —
not to the degree that I had —Copy !req
1115. and so I suppose there was
an unspoken relationship —Copy !req
1116. or we thought we had
this modern relationship where...Copy !req
1117. if the affair existed outside there
and didn't come back and haunt us...Copy !req
1118. then it was all right.
We kept a distance on it.Copy !req
1119. Also, the other thing was that
we were both so into riding...Copy !req
1120. on the magic carpet of my celebrity...Copy !req
1121. that we just didn't look at the underbelly
of the relationship for a lot of time.Copy !req
1122. Things were rolling so fast.Copy !req
1123. So Kathie — that was breaking
the boundaries...Copy !req
1124. because I was never supposed
to have one in New York City.Copy !req
1125. But I had met Kathie on the road,
and she moved to New York.Copy !req
1126. She moved to Thomas Street
in downtown Manhattan.Copy !req
1127. Now, the odd thing about that
was I grew up...Copy !req
1128. near Thomas Street
in Barrington, Rhode Island.Copy !req
1129. But I didn't have a girlfriend
when I was 16...Copy !req
1130. because I dated my mom
until I was 23.Copy !req
1131. So to some extent,
I think I was going back to that.Copy !req
1132. And I'm not saying I was having
an affair with the street.Copy !req
1133. I'm saying that people
were becoming like signifiers to me.Copy !req
1134. It was like I was in a movie,
and I didn't know whose film it was...Copy !req
1135. and I was going through the motions,
and it was feeling good but confusing...Copy !req
1136. and I was approaching 52,
and things were really getting complicated.Copy !req
1137. Renée wanted to get married again.Copy !req
1138. "Again" — we'd never been married,
but she was pushing for it again.Copy !req
1139. And I thought,
"I should be able to give her that gift.Copy !req
1140. We've been together so many years."
And if I got married...Copy !req
1141. that would automatically
end the affair.Copy !req
1142. But I was so timid about it...Copy !req
1143. I had to propose to her
in front of my therapist...Copy !req
1144. who knew I was having
an affair with Kathie...Copy !req
1145. and said nothing about it.Copy !req
1146. In fact, I brought Kathie in
to meet him...Copy !req
1147. and we had a session, and afterward
she went to use his bathroom, and he said...Copy !req
1148. "She's quite European
in her attitudes.Copy !req
1149. She's like a French woman."Copy !req
1150. I said, "Well, you dog!
You want to fuck her, don't you?"Copy !req
1151. He said, "No, no!"Copy !req
1152. And then he had a very bad
countertransference...Copy !req
1153. and died of a heart attack
before I could kill him.Copy !req
1154. I didn't think I could do
another monologue.Copy !req
1155. I pretty much almost cracked up
just before this monologue was —Copy !req
1156. Are you serious? Come on.Copy !req
1157. Yeah, was told
that I was manic-depressive...Copy !req
1158. was on Klonopin and lithium
and seeing a top psychopharmacologist —Copy !req
1159. - Are you serious?
- Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.Copy !req
1160. I don't know if that monologue
gives a flavor...Copy !req
1161. of the — of the crack-up.Copy !req
1162. And I —Copy !req
1163. Skiing really gave me a sense of balance
in the middle of that crack-up.Copy !req
1164. But what was the question?Copy !req
1165. What didn't you tell us
we might want to know?Copy !req
1166. Oh, my God! That was in the therapist's
office. That's what helped me through.Copy !req
1167. I had a very good...Copy !req
1168. woman therapist that —Copy !req
1169. I laid out the stuff. I laid out
my shadow in her lap, as it were...Copy !req
1170. and we began to figure out
what was public and what was private.Copy !req
1171. When Kathie told me she was pregnant,
I fell down on the floor...Copy !req
1172. and went into a fetal position...Copy !req
1173. and when I got up, I said...Copy !req
1174. "Get rid of it. Get rid of it."Copy !req
1175. And she said, "Not so fast.Copy !req
1176. This is my body.
I have to think about it.Copy !req
1177. If I have this child, I will raise it.
I will be committed to it."Copy !req
1178. And I got out of there,
and I went out on tour...Copy !req
1179. and I sent her money for an abortion,
and I called her and sent her letters...Copy !req
1180. and on September 27, 1992...Copy !req
1181. Kathie gave birth to a son...Copy !req
1182. and named him
Forrest Dylan Gray.Copy !req
1183. This was extremely traumatic.Copy !req
1184. Renée cried. I cried.Copy !req
1185. Kathie cried. Forrest cried.Copy !req
1186. And Renée requested me...Copy !req
1187. not to see this child until there was
some reconciliation between us...Copy !req
1188. and I couldn't deal with any of it
and went out on tour.Copy !req
1189. And out there,
I got more and more agoraphobic...Copy !req
1190. and wasn't going out of my hotel...Copy !req
1191. and Renée called and said,
"You've got to come back.Copy !req
1192. I've seen the baby in a snuggly in Kathie's
arms, and I am in bed, devastated."Copy !req
1193. And I said,
"You've got to give me a day."Copy !req
1194. And she said, "If you take a day,
I won't be here for you."Copy !req
1195. I took two days.
I took two days...Copy !req
1196. because I couldn't even find myself...Copy !req
1197. to walk out of the hotel,
I was so split...Copy !req
1198. with an image of myself
sitting on the bed, comforting Renée...Copy !req
1199. and an image of myself
standing next to Kathie...Copy !req
1200. meeting my son for the first time.Copy !req
1201. And the split was so great,
it took three people...Copy !req
1202. to get me out
to the San Francisco airport...Copy !req
1203. jerking and barking all the way.Copy !req
1204. This time, the captain
of the American Airlines came out.Copy !req
1205. My friend talked to him, and the captain said,
"I don't care who he is.Copy !req
1206. Do you know what it costs
to land this plane in Kansas?"Copy !req
1207. And somehow —
and I don't know how Bill did this —Copy !req
1208. he convinced the captain I was rehearsing
for a psychotic role in a Scorsese movie.Copy !req
1209. And Renée said,
"This is it. I can't —Copy !req
1210. I have to draw a boundary here.
I'm moving out with a friend for a while."Copy !req
1211. And when she left the loft...Copy !req
1212. she took the feeling with her.Copy !req
1213. There was no heart left in that room.Copy !req
1214. I turned to stone.
I turned to a dead thing.Copy !req
1215. And I had not realized
for 14 years...Copy !req
1216. Renée had been filling
the room with the feeling.Copy !req
1217. And I took a bottle of vodka
and knocked down a few shots...Copy !req
1218. and began to feel my breath
and thought...Copy !req
1219. "What do I want to do?"Copy !req
1220. And I thought,
"I would like to see my son.Copy !req
1221. He's eight months old.
I've never seen him."Copy !req
1222. And I called Kathie and I said,
"I'm coming down."Copy !req
1223. And I came down,
and she took him out of the crib...Copy !req
1224. and he went right for her breast...Copy !req
1225. and I knew there was
no need for a blood test.Copy !req
1226. I saw the shape of my father's head
in the back of his head.Copy !req
1227. I saw my brother Rocky's eyes
in his eyes.Copy !req
1228. I saw a distant mirror.
I saw a little lust flower.Copy !req
1229. I saw a completely formed
human being.Copy !req
1230. I saw a glorious accident.Copy !req
1231. And I had a perfect paradox
at that moment, where I thought...Copy !req
1232. "Now you can die,
and you must stay alive...Copy !req
1233. to help this little guy through."Copy !req
1234. My dad died three days
after I saw my son...Copy !req
1235. not knowing he had
his first grandson.Copy !req
1236. I didn't even know
my father was dying.Copy !req
1237. My stepmother didn't call
to tell me he was in the hospital...Copy !req
1238. she was so angry with me
at the way I portrayed her...Copy !req
1239. in my book Impossible Vacation.Copy !req
1240. Sorry you can't stick around
and spend a little time here.Copy !req
1241. Yeah. As always...Copy !req
1242. I'm off on another toot.Copy !req
1243. - Back to Boston?
- Yeah. You should come up.Copy !req
1244. Well, maybe we will.
Except for the traffic.Copy !req
1245. Right. I hope we don't hit it.Copy !req
1246. But I don't know when —
next time we'll see each other.Copy !req
1247. Well, you're going
to Florida at Christmas.Copy !req
1248. Yeah, and then
to Australia on January 11.Copy !req
1249. So we won't see you again
till probably March, hmm?Copy !req
1250. - Uh, April, more like.
- April.Copy !req
1251. Are you going up to the house
in the mountains in April?Copy !req
1252. - I think I'm gonna try to sell that house.
- Oh, are you?Copy !req
1253. What are you going to do
about the foundation?Copy !req
1254. Try to sell it. They say
there's a sucker born every minute...Copy !req
1255. and if there is,
I'll let them take it over.Copy !req
1256. We want to get a house
out in the Hamptons...Copy !req
1257. believe it or not,
closer to the water.Copy !req
1258. What's it like being a dad?
How has that changed your life?Copy !req
1259. Being a dad is fantastic.
It's very grounding, very connecting.Copy !req
1260. And it's got me out of myself, because
believe me — and you must know this...Copy !req
1261. and everyone that has children knows it —
their needs are bigger than yours...Copy !req
1262. and they are so obviously bigger.Copy !req
1263. - That's right.
- It really relativizes yours.Copy !req
1264. You talked about your dad
in the excerpt a moment ago.Copy !req
1265. What did you learn from your dad
about raising kids?Copy !req
1266. It's all been learned now,
after his death, I'm sad to say...Copy !req
1267. 'cause I'm a father late in life,
and I'd love to thank him...Copy !req
1268. for what he went through with us,
his three boys.Copy !req
1269. And I've learned
to appreciate him in absence.Copy !req
1270. Yeah!Copy !req
1271. Yeah!Copy !req
1272. - That's great!
- Stick your foot out.Copy !req
1273. Oh, my God!Copy !req
1274. So the new monologue is called
Morning, Noon and Night...Copy !req
1275. and it's about my life living
with the family here in this house.Copy !req
1276. And of course, my fear is that
once I tell the story...Copy !req
1277. or organize the chaos
about the family...Copy !req
1278. I'll be looking for the next story,
which means I'll have to leave the family.Copy !req
1279. So that's the risk of the work.Copy !req
1280. And when she moved to New York City
with her daughter, Marissa —Copy !req
1281. and Marissa was three —
I continued to meet her there.Copy !req
1282. And I first met Marissa at a party
in downtown New York City.Copy !req
1283. And Marissa had a sense that
the name Spalding Gray existed...Copy !req
1284. because I'd call the loft a lot
to talk with Kathie...Copy !req
1285. but she could never get her imagination
around "Spalding Gray"...Copy !req
1286. so she referred to me as
"Splendid Café"...Copy !req
1287. which I thought was a great stage name
if I ever needed one.Copy !req
1288. I think we're going to get away
with this one story about the family.Copy !req
1289. I wouldn't want to turn it
into Ozzie and Harriet...Copy !req
1290. and make an ongoing soap opera,
because the children would then be...Copy !req
1291. minor heroes
before they were greater people.Copy !req
1292. We move into the house,
and new life comes.Copy !req
1293. Kathie gets pregnant.Copy !req
1294. How did this happen?Copy !req
1295. "I don't think I want this child.Copy !req
1296. I'm content now with our new home
and the family configuration as it is"...Copy !req
1297. I told my therapist.Copy !req
1298. Kathie's sure it's gonna be a girl.
She's convinced me it's gonna be a girl.Copy !req
1299. We're gonna name her
Eliza Ann Gray.Copy !req
1300. Eleven hours into labor here,
the storm is still raging.Copy !req
1301. It's the next day, and Kathie
can only find one comfortable position.Copy !req
1302. She's on all fours,
like a wild animal.Copy !req
1303. The nurses are not approving.
I know it's not Northern California.Copy !req
1304. I'm trying to get the hermetically sealed
window open to get a little air in there.Copy !req
1305. Marissa's dozing in the corner
with her little camera...Copy !req
1306. and all of a sudden,
it starts to come.Copy !req
1307. And I just have time to get on
my scrubs and roll Kathie over.Copy !req
1308. I'm helping. I'm pushing one knee back.
The other nurse has the other knee...Copy !req
1309. and I look down and —
Oh, my God!Copy !req
1310. It looks like she's giving birth
to a dead beaver!Copy !req
1311. "What is that hairy blue football...Copy !req
1312. and how is it gonna fit
through that —"Copy !req
1313. Pow! And it's out!
And I go...Copy !req
1314. "Whoa!
Look at the balls on that girl!"Copy !req
1315. And I lean over
and kiss Kathie and cry...Copy !req
1316. and bend down and cut the umbilical cord,
and the crimson blood flies...Copy !req
1317. and I look down
at this glorious accident, Theo.Copy !req
1318. We just grabbed that name out the air
in case it was a boy.Copy !req
1319. "Theo," short for nothing.Copy !req
1320. Short for "the study of God."Copy !req
1321. Theo Spalding Gray.Copy !req
1322. And back at me is coming this totally
perplexed face with the big "Why?"Copy !req
1323. "Why this?Copy !req
1324. Why something and not nothing?"Copy !req
1325. And I totally identify with it.
And I know that he's not mirroring me.Copy !req
1326. He hasn't been in the world
long enough to pick up on my face.Copy !req
1327. He's brought this in with him.Copy !req
1328. And I think, "Oh, little one,
you may have already spent...Copy !req
1329. the best days of your life...Copy !req
1330. in there."Copy !req
1331. I think of poetic journalism
as telling a relatively true story..Copy !req
1332. but after you've digested it, filtered it
through your own imagination...Copy !req
1333. and then tell it with poetry,
with flavor...Copy !req
1334. with innuendo,
with hyperbole...Copy !req
1335. so that it starts
as a true story...Copy !req
1336. but it's filtered
through my imagination.Copy !req
1337. So at its best, it comes out
as a form of poetry.Copy !req
1338. Forrest came to me very early on
with questions about death.Copy !req
1339. He wasn't even four.
And I just was very honest with him.Copy !req
1340. I said, "You know,
everyone that comes in has to go out.Copy !req
1341. That's just the whole rule of it.
That's how it goes.Copy !req
1342. And it's probably, in a way, comforting.
It's the only thing we really know.Copy !req
1343. And the funny thing, Forrest,
about death is — or not funny, really,Copy !req
1344. because I don't think there's
anything funny about death —Copy !req
1345. but the odd thing is,
is that, you know...Copy !req
1346. everyone knows
they're going to die...Copy !req
1347. but no one really believes it."Copy !req
1348. All of my life — Or so many of us
were brought up with the idea...Copy !req
1349. of the ethereal-ness of death...Copy !req
1350. and you're going to go off
into the vapors and to heaven.Copy !req
1351. And I think that we return
to the elements...Copy !req
1352. and that age is a great pain
but also a great comfort.Copy !req
1353. It's a great paradox,
because the older I get...Copy !req
1354. the more weight I feel
and the more aware of gravity.Copy !req
1355. You know, I only live once.Copy !req
1356. I'm sure the configuration
of Spalding Gray...Copy !req
1357. there's only room for it one time around,
so I know I won't be reincarnated.Copy !req
1358. One of the ways
to reincarnate is to tell your story.Copy !req
1359. And I get enormous pleasure from that.
It's like coming back.Copy !req
1360. They're probably gonna go in
and play in front of the fire...Copy !req
1361. and put music on, maybe.Copy !req
1362. If Marissa wins, and she usually does,
it'll be Spice Girls.Copy !req
1363. If Forrest gets his way, it'll be Hanson.Copy !req
1364. Kathie and I are gonna just
hang out here a little more...Copy !req
1365. and have more chardonnay
with Theo and relax.Copy !req
1366. "Keep it down in there.
Please keep it down."Copy !req
1367. Sounds like a compromise, huh?Copy !req
1368. I don't know what they chose.Copy !req
1369. What is it?Copy !req
1370. Hey! It's Chumbawamba!Copy !req
1371. I can't resist. Pumpin' out.Copy !req
1372. Wow! Hey! Whoo!Copy !req
1373. Marissa's doing ballet leaps
across the living room floor.Copy !req
1374. Forrest enters,
twirling like a dervish.Copy !req
1375. Theo comes in and starts doing pliés
on the wingback chair.Copy !req
1376. Kathie enters,
walkin' like an Egyptian.Copy !req
1377. Hey, we're dancing. The whole family's
dancing to Chumbawamba.Copy !req
1378. And we all go downtown
for ice cream.Copy !req
1379. I always felt that I would always be
publicly talking about something...Copy !req
1380. and I never know what
the next thing is gonna be...Copy !req
1381. but I suspect that
as long as I have a voice...Copy !req
1382. there will be a story, you know?Copy !req
1383. This is a great entrance.Copy !req
1384. Boy, we had so much —Copy !req
1385. It was hard to film at Robbie's with
all the planes, and they're over here too.Copy !req
1386. But I now know how to get up the steps.
I'm able to jump steps, so —Copy !req
1387. - That's an acquired skill.
- It's a new breakthrough for me. Yeah.Copy !req
1388. So I've gotten
to this real stationary place...Copy !req
1389. where I don't have to do anything...Copy !req
1390. and people wait on me,
and I just observe.Copy !req
1391. I feel like a real outsider...Copy !req
1392. kind of like I'm half dead.Copy !req
1393. In a funny way, it's a treat...Copy !req
1394. just to be a witness.Copy !req
1395. I don't want to see the ocean.Copy !req
1396. 'Cause the last thing I picture myself was,
I was Boogie-boarding in June...Copy !req
1397. and I said, "I don't want to leave here.
I don't want to go to Ireland.Copy !req
1398. I'm riding the waves with Forrest,
and this is great.Copy !req
1399. You know, my life is good."Copy !req
1400. And I said, "The past five years
have been the best five years of my life."Copy !req
1401. - And then boom.
- And then it happened like that.Copy !req
1402. - When did it happen, anyway?
- June 23rd.Copy !req
1403. - When did you guys arrive in Ireland?
- The day before, the 21st.Copy !req
1404. Yeah, we celebrated
the longest day there...Copy !req
1405. and Kathie and I had
the master bedroom...Copy !req
1406. and we had
one great, erotic night...Copy !req
1407. and the next day, end of story.Copy !req
1408. End of story line.Copy !req
1409. You were coming back from dinner
from your birthday?Copy !req
1410. From a restaurant.
We were one mile from home.Copy !req
1411. And, um...Copy !req
1412. And you guys were just in the car, and you
came around a curve and you got hit?Copy !req
1413. No, he came around a curve.
Kathie slowed to stop to turn...Copy !req
1414. and this van came hurtling
right into her.Copy !req
1415. I don't think he even broke.
I could see it coming.Copy !req
1416. It looked like a video game,
like I was playing a video game.Copy !req
1417. You just can't accept it.Copy !req
1418. And then... huge crash.Copy !req
1419. And the car just — Our car spun around.
He pushed it around.Copy !req
1420. The next thing, I was lying
in the road in a puddle of blood...Copy !req
1421. and there was this woman
nursing me.Copy !req
1422. She was the Good Samaritan. Somehow —
She lived in the neighborhood...Copy !req
1423. and heard Tara screaming...Copy !req
1424. and she lost her nine-year-old son
there a year ago.Copy !req
1425. - In a car accident?
- He fell out of the car.Copy !req
1426. The car skidded,
and he was almost decapitated.Copy !req
1427. And I was her son, in a way.
She kept talking me down...Copy !req
1428. and nursing me and saying,
"You're gonna be all right."Copy !req
1429. And I couldn't see out of this eye,
which is my good eye...Copy !req
1430. 'cause there was so much blood.Copy !req
1431. So I couldn't see past the blood.
And there was all this...Copy !req
1432. they told me, cow medicine
everywhere, and the weird thing —Copy !req
1433. - Cow medicine?
- Because it was a veterinarian that hit us.Copy !req
1434. And the weird thing was
just earlier in the day...Copy !req
1435. I saw a very sick calf
that couldn't get up...Copy !req
1436. 'cause its leg was —
Something was wrong with its hip.Copy !req
1437. And I went to a farmer, I said,
"That cow should be...Copy !req
1438. put out of its misery
or taken care of."Copy !req
1439. And the guy said, "Yeah, I know.
We're gonna call a vet."Copy !req
1440. So my fantasy is that I set it up.Copy !req
1441. It's hard to be relative and hard to —
I mean, when I was complaining...Copy !req
1442. to a nurse one day, she said, "Shall I
take you to the spinal ward, then?"Copy !req
1443. You know? In a way, that sobered me up
and made me thankful...Copy !req
1444. and in another way, I was annoyed that
she's not honoring the place that I'm in.Copy !req
1445. I never thought I'd want to rush back
from Ireland to have head surgery...Copy !req
1446. but there's some reconstruction of my skull
that will have to be done next week.Copy !req
1447. So now I've got another comparison...Copy !req
1448. of New York hospitals versus Irish ones,
so who knows what it's about?Copy !req
1449. But I think there's enormous
amounts of material there...Copy !req
1450. that, once processed,
will be something.Copy !req
1451. - You have everything you need?
- I think so.Copy !req
1452. Want to bring
the cards over, Marissa?Copy !req
1453. Hi. Come on over.Copy !req
1454. - Are you ushering?
- Yes.Copy !req
1455. Okay.Copy !req
1456. Does that mean
you get to watch the show?Copy !req
1457. Would you be interested
in being interviewed tonight?Copy !req
1458. Um, I'm not up to it tonight, no.Copy !req
1459. What's that? I can't hear you.
Come on over.Copy !req
1460. No, actually, I'm not feeling
too great tonight, so —Copy !req
1461. - You're what?
- I'm not feeling too great tonight.Copy !req
1462. - Oh, I know the feeling.
- How are you, by the way?Copy !req
1463. - What's wrong?
- I don't know.Copy !req
1464. I woke up and —
I actually woke up — I didn't sleep.Copy !req
1465. Oh, you didn't sleep.
I didn't last night either.Copy !req
1466. No. I, uh —
It was one of those.Copy !req
1467. - Yeah? It's hard.
- How are you, by the way?Copy !req
1468. Oh, so-so.
I'm coming along.Copy !req
1469. - I had a few of those.
- Oh, you did?Copy !req
1470. Accidents?
You had a few accidents?Copy !req
1471. I'm going onstage now.
Going backstage.Copy !req
1472. Are we going to watch?Copy !req
1473. - Yeah. Where's Mom?
- Can I watch you?Copy !req
1474. You can watch
from the audience.Copy !req
1475. Many people asked me
about the crutches...Copy !req
1476. and some people had heard
about this, uh, accident —Copy !req
1477. which I hope that that's all it was,
was an accident.Copy !req
1478. So I'd like to begin, if I could...Copy !req
1479. if you don't mind being an opener...Copy !req
1480. and you can come right up
this center stage here.Copy !req
1481. And I'm not even going
to say your name...Copy !req
1482. 'cause I know you want to be anonymous.Copy !req
1483. There's one Irish nurse that stuck
with me in that St. James Hospital...Copy !req
1484. that I'll never forget
named Carmella.Copy !req
1485. Irish nurses stand for 12 hours.
I kept telling her to sit down.Copy !req
1486. She said, "We're trained
to stand for 12 hours at a time."Copy !req
1487. She stands at attention
by my wheelchair, you know?Copy !req
1488. And I'm just going crazy
from just boredom...Copy !req
1489. and so I start to interview her,
and I said, "Carmella...Copy !req
1490. how do you —
Do you go to church?"Copy !req
1491. "Oh, no, no.
I'm not real keen on the Catholic Church."Copy !req
1492. - "Why?"
- "With their stand on abortion and all."Copy !req
1493. And I said,
"Well, aren't you afraid of dying, then?Copy !req
1494. Because you won't have the priest there
to do the Holy Communion...Copy !req
1495. and if you're not going to Mass —"Copy !req
1496. She said, "Ah, no.
I'm not afraid of death...Copy !req
1497. because the only sin
is hurtin' someone...Copy !req
1498. and I haven't done that."Copy !req
1499. And I looked at her and I knew...Copy !req
1500. - she hadn't.
- Wow.Copy !req
1501. - And it was startling. Startling.
- Wow.Copy !req
1502. - 'Cause I sure couldn't do it, couldn't say—
- What are you worried about?Copy !req
1503. The next accident, because I —Copy !req
1504. Fuck it all!
I know this one isn't clearing the air.Copy !req
1505. The next plane crash,
getting home from here.Copy !req
1506. When I was in Ireland, the first thing I did
when we were in that country home...Copy !req
1507. was to climb this hill
to look out over...Copy !req
1508. the whole of the countryside
of Westmeath.Copy !req
1509. And fields and fields and fields
and fields and farmyards —Copy !req
1510. "No water" was the first thing that —Copy !req
1511. - My eye went for that.
- For the water?Copy !req
1512. Yeah. Wherever I am, I'm setting up
myself by direction of water.Copy !req
1513. So would you be able to help me
with this rooting issue?Copy !req
1514. What did you call it?Copy !req
1515. This issue of not feeling
you can stay in one place?Copy !req
1516. - Yeah.
- I don't know. I'm not sure.Copy !req
1517. I'm not sure
if it isn't a hopeless case.Copy !req
1518. We've been out here five years,
my family and I.Copy !req
1519. - Kathie and the three children.
- How do you like it?Copy !req
1520. I have problems with it
in the winter.Copy !req
1521. Um, it's not New Age enough for me.Copy !req
1522. I'm very attracted
to alternative therapies...Copy !req
1523. and-and diet...Copy !req
1524. and I think I drink too much out here.Copy !req
1525. It's a drinking culture.
Either everyone drinks or no one drinks.Copy !req
1526. People say that it has to do with the sea —
the mother, the sea.Copy !req
1527. The sea is your mother.
You must know that one.Copy !req
1528. And that a way to get to the mother
is through inebriation.Copy !req
1529. I mean —Copy !req
1530. When I drink, I feel like
I'm coming closer to the mother.Copy !req
1531. That-That old thing of when you're stuck
on the breast, that great —Copy !req
1532. That, you know — that bliss.Copy !req
1533. Do you have anything
you want to ask me?Copy !req
1534. Um, what are your thoughts
on the meaning of life?Copy !req
1535. Well, now that you ask —Copy !req
1536. I'm not —
Well, I don't believe in fate.Copy !req
1537. I'm rather a chaos person.Copy !req
1538. There's a series of interviews out...Copy !req
1539. with different philosophers,
and it's called The Glorious Accident.Copy !req
1540. Consciousness.
The definition of consciousness.Copy !req
1541. The Glorious Accident.
So that's kind of my take on life —Copy !req
1542. "the glorious accident" —
although my accident was —Copy !req
1543. - Not too glorious.
- Yeah.Copy !req
1544. Up until now,
I'd said that I've always felt...Copy !req
1545. that I was
an embracer of accidents...Copy !req
1546. 'cause my life has been...Copy !req
1547. serendipity and accident
and not a lot of planning.Copy !req
1548. Thank you for coming.Copy !req
1549. I was always worried that my epitaph,
which I will never see, will read...Copy !req
1550. "Spalding Gray,
who found a niche of talking —Copy !req
1551. making a living of talking about himself."Copy !req
1552. And the dog is already howling
for the dead Spalding Gray.Copy !req
1553. And I would hope that it would say,
"Talking about himself...Copy !req
1554. and his loved ones
and people he's encountered...Copy !req
1555. in his travels."Copy !req
1556. You know?
I mean, I am not Samuel Beckett.Copy !req
1557. I'm not a navel-gazer.Copy !req
1558. Beckett's a great writer,
but I'm not a minimalist in that way.Copy !req
1559. I'm talking about the world as I see it.Copy !req
1560. God, that's just wild.
It's like Chekhov.Copy !req
1561. It's become a great sound effect.Copy !req
1562. I'll think of that at night.Copy !req
1563. It's a lamentation.Copy !req